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[Rob R.]

They don't turn on and off in milliseconds because a cloud floated overhead either. The excess production from conventional plants is exacerbated by intermittent power production from renewables.

And it is the conventional power plants that are told to drop output when the sun shines or the wind blows….I got to witness this first hand on my last trip to Massena. I thought it was odd they were bypassing so much water around the power dam on a scorching hot day so I asked one of the guys that works there what the sorry was. He said they were told to “shed” capacity to make room for the above average output of solar and wind that day.

It seems odd to me that they would not give priority to hydropower.

[k-2]

It seems odd to me that they would not give priority to hydropower.

Yes since the hydro power is one of the cheapest forms of power generation and pollution free. No savings there if they have to throw away free power. Either need storage or incentives for customers to use more power during those times.

[ColdHouse]

Maybe we just stumbled on the end game solution.
They will simply turn off all the grid tied solar and wind when it is not needed.

The main production must be kept constant. So inevitably there will be a pecking order.

I guess another option is they will simply reduce overall production to the minimum level to keep all things running when the sun isn't shining, and then when demand is high and there is not enough, just do rolling blackouts.

Or, the next big push will be for a national grid or world wide grid.

Those in power will make the rules that you need to abide by.

[anthony7812]

What ? Can’t turn off fossil fuel plants in milliseconds ????

Combustion equipment isn’t the electrical component of a power plant. The electrical equipment used to regulate wattage absolutely can be controlled in real time. Load unload regulate is no different than solar or wind …. On the power regulation side. Load banks , capacitor banks , line reactors , inverters , auto tap transformers. Stop spewing garbage. #Fakenews

[ColdHouse]

What ? Can’t turn off fossil fuel plants in milliseconds ????

Combustion equipment isn’t the electrical component of a power plant. The electrical equipment used to regulate wattage absolutely can be controlled in real time. Load unload regulate is no different than solar or wind …. On the power regulation side. Load banks , capacitor banks , line reactors , inverters , auto tap transformers. Stop spewing garbage. #Fakenews

I know little to nothing about power generation. All I know is those in power want to control your power.

[BigBarney]

"The main production must be kept constant. So inevitably there will be a pecking order."

There is a pecking order... Use the least expensive first...

It seems unusual that they would curtail hydro when it a low cost supply...

Here is where you get energy for 2 cents/Kwh and they want to keep gas ...

https://enewspaper.latimes.com/infinity/article_s ... 4668f66482

"Under the 25-year contract with developer 8minute Solar Energy, the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power would pay less than 2 cents per kilowatt-hour — a number city officials and independent experts say would be the lowest price ever paid for solar power in the United States, and cheaper than the cost of electricity from a typical natural gas-fired power plant.

In addition to 400 megawatts of solar power, the Eland project would include at least 200 megawatts of lithium-ion batteries, capable of storing solar power during the day and injecting it into the grid for four hours each night.

The combined price to L.A. ratepayers of the solar and storage would be 3.3 cents per kilowatt-hour — also a record low for this type of contract."

We need a lot more BESS systems to be able to harvest energy when available for use in high demand times...

BigBarney

[Richard S.]

It seems unusual that they would curtail hydro when it a low cost supply...

It makes perfect sense when you have mandates, tax credits, carbon credits and need to maximize production on competing product to justify it's existence. Sensibility goes out the window when there is a pile of money on the table.

[ColdHouse]

"The main production must be kept constant. So inevitably there will be a pecking order."

There is a pecking order... Use the least expensive first...

It seems unusual that they would curtail hydro when it a low cost supply...

Here is where you get energy for 2 cents/Kwh and they want to keep gas ...

https://enewspaper.latimes.com/infinity/article_s ... 4668f66482

"Under the 25-year contract with developer 8minute Solar Energy, the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power would pay less than 2 cents per kilowatt-hour — a number city officials and independent experts say would be the lowest price ever paid for solar power in the United States, and cheaper than the cost of electricity from a typical natural gas-fired power plant.

In addition to 400 megawatts of solar power, the Eland project would include at least 200 megawatts of lithium-ion batteries, capable of storing solar power during the day and injecting it into the grid for four hours each night.

The combined price to L.A. ratepayers of the solar and storage would be 3.3 cents per kilowatt-hour — also a record low for this type of contract."

We need a lot more BESS systems to be able to harvest energy when available for use in high demand times...

BigBarney

What will the LA homeowner total cost per kWh be with this cheap solar?

[warminmn]

What will the LA homeowner total cost per kWh be with this cheap solar?

Link says 3.3 cents to ratepayers. Its in your quote. But its only supplying 6 or 7% of the power so I doubt they will notice the cost in their bills.

And dont forget the subsides and various other ways that the project cost those same consumers tax money already. Add that to the 3.3 cents.

The 500ish acres near me, its been 11 months of work now (its almost done) for 50-100 workers 5 days a week, minus a couple weeks of bad weather. Thats not counting the 4.5 million dollars for part of the land plus rent for the rest, plus all the materials to build it. All that money is coming from somewhere and Im sure a lot of it from taxpayers. Why would California be any different?

[BigBarney]

And future power plants using fusion are shooting for 35 cents a Kwh...

They are pie in the sky...They are dead on arrival...

They are too late and too expensive...

We need more solar and especially a lot more storage batteries..

The cost of power is the cost of distribution not the energy cost...

Look at your bill and see the cost of electric to compare all suppliers...

In NY the hydro power is part of our base load and steady...

BigBarney

[Richard S.]

They are too late and too expensive...

Barney this technology will supersede all others. There is no if but when.

We need more solar and especially a lot more storage batteries.

.

More $$$.

The cost of power is the cost of distribution not the energy cost...

One of the benefits of fusion is they can be placed right in the heart of a city with a very small footprint. Another interesting thing is as the plant scales the energy output scales exponentially. I was told you could power all of NYC with a plant the size of one city block.