Lost my draft

B, Glad to see that your stove is performing better, & is primarily a direct result of tightening up the chimney there-by preventing outside air infiltration. However, it should also be quite evident by now that any coal stove that requires constant secondary air in order to function, unequivocally indicates a problem with the chimney. And it would appear that a new liner might be just what the doctor ordered. Keep up the good work.
Jim

coalder wrote: ↑

Sun. Jan. 17, 2021 2:22 pm

B, Glad to see that your stove is performing better, & is primarily a direct result of tightening up the chimney there-by preventing outside air infiltration. However, it should also be quite evident by now that any coal stove that requires constant secondary air in order to function, unequivocally indicates a problem with the chimney. And it would appear that a new liner might be just what the doctor ordered. Keep up the good work.
Jim

I talked to two different chimney professionals about my situation. They both said without hesitation to stick a liner in without insulation due to the 7x7 inside measurements of my chimney. They both said that going from a square to round flue alone will increase draft, along with the fact that there will be no possibility for air infiltration into the flue gases from possible leaks in the chimney. If I want to put insulation wrap on it, I will need to find somewhere that rents a flue tile breaker and go through the process of bashing out all the clay inside the chimney.

This is just a thought but I would think the dead air space in the existing chimney around the steel liner would act as insulation to some degree. The thimble will be sealed tight and I would pack the top of the chimney tightly with Roxul around the liner before installing the liner top plate so that should trap any air inside the chimney and not allow any movement.

B, I agree on all accounts, & with the your theory on dead air space insulation. Would it be nice to insulate the pipe? Yes; However I believe you will be fine w/o it. Busting out those flues would be a bitch along with the possibility of damaging the veneer in the process. IMO, go just with the liner & point up as you can. Just having a liner that doesn't leak will make a world of difference. Keep us posted.
Jim

Isn't there some sort of chain whip that chimney sweeps use to break out the clay liner?

My 30-95 has never worked better. I had problems with loss of draft last year during warm periods thru the winter and at times it appears I didn't have enough draft for the stove to work properly. Installed a draft inducer to solve that problem. It alone provided way more draft than needed so I installed the baro I used with my last stove to control the draft. Somewhere I got the idea that a 30-95 didn't need a damper or baro . Anyway with the baro installed draft stays right around .025 and the baro takes care of the wind gusts. It may be I really didn't need the inducer. Perhaps the chimney needed a little more air. And no way to provide a little over fire air with the 30-95. No more fooling with the stove trying to keep it working as it should. Tend it twice a day. Set the dial on the back to the stove temperature I need and forget it. I did install a 2 ft. chimney extension last year and removed the stainless directional cap I was using. I have no need for it anymore. It fits an 8 inch clay liner. If someone could use it PM me.

I recently learned there are two sizes of 8"x8" liners...that don't even measure that size at all...they are just called that. My old liners or a good bit bigger than the two new ones I just bought. Both considered 8"x8". Mason told me they have names for them, but I forgot.

ReidH wrote: ↑

Sun. Jan. 17, 2021 5:25 pm

Isn't there some sort of chain whip that chimney sweeps use to break out the clay liner?

Yes they do they have little steel pieces on the ends of the chains hook them to some rods and a big electric drill and go to town wracking the clay tiles. Rockford chimney supply sells them.

Rockford Chimney supply even rents them. I think I mentioned that back pages ago. Anyway... there you go.

Well throughout all conditions, the baro kept the draft alive. That being said, I ordered up a lifetime warranted stainless steel line and installed it. It was not an enjoyable experience by any means. I packed the top of the chimney with rockwool and sealed the thimble with refractory. Draft is even better now as hoped and expected. Pipe temp at thimble 108. Stove temp 300 with blower on low. Draft -.05 to -.06. So this is how my saga ends. Now we will see if the liner will stand up to coal as they claim. Good thing I have everything in writing stating it’s transferable lifetime warranty wether I sweep it or not, insulated or not, coal wood whatever.

What kind was it? I think I would clean it as if it would rot if you didn’t clean it.

Then you always know it is clean and in good condition.

Interested in knowing how you feel about it after some time and a few cold spells.

BlackBetty06 wrote: ↑

Thu. Feb. 18, 2021 10:15 pm

Well throughout all conditions, the baro kept the draft alive. That being said, I ordered up a lifetime warranted stainless steel line and installed it. It was not an enjoyable experience by any means. I packed the top of the chimney with rockwool and sealed the thimble with refractory. Draft is even better now as hoped and expected. Pipe temp at thimble 108. Stove temp 300 with blower on low. Draft -.05 to -.06. So this is how my saga ends. Now we will see if the liner will stand up to coal as they claim. Good thing I have everything in writing stating it’s transferable lifetime warranty wether I sweep it or not, insulated or not, coal wood whatever.

That was like a short novel with a lot of characters with wild ideas...lol I'm glad it everything turned out well for you !

Erik Carstens wrote: ↑

Fri. Feb. 19, 2021 1:01 am

That was like a short novel with a lot of characters with wild ideas...lol I'm glad it everything turned out well for you !

Lol this made me laugh.

Hoyt- I think you misunderstood what I said and I can see how. Some liner manufacturers require that a registered sweep clean the liner yearly and not the homeowner(me obviously). That is what I meant about wether I sweep it or not. I certainly will sweep yearly and prob dust it with baking soda at seasons end to help neutralize any acids. I bought it from Rockford Chimney Supply. It is a 316ti stainless steel forever flex liner. I too am excited to see it burn full blast. Supposed to be cold today and tomorrow so I’m gonna crank it up. I’ll post back

My 316ti stainless liner lasted 5 years before rotting through. Think it came from Rockford also but didn't come with a lifetime warranty at that time (2014). Current liner, a Copperfield Homesaver, did come with a lifetime warranty but I have to have it professionally cleaned yearly & keep records.

BB, there is a LOT of info on cleaning stainless between seasons on this site. You may want to research that before using baking soda on it.

But regardless im glad you found 2 fixes, the baro and the chimney. You did well and solved all the issues.

JohnB wrote: ↑

Fri. Feb. 19, 2021 7:03 am

My 316ti stainless liner lasted 5 years before rotting through. Think it came from Rockford also but didn't come with a lifetime warranty at that time (2014). Current liner, a Copperfield Homesaver, did come with a lifetime warranty but I have to have it professionally cleaned yearly & keep records.

BB, this is why I said what I did, regardless of who cleans your liner. Pictures have been posted here of these liners, yes 316Ti, just has John has posted lasting 5 years before rotting through. My point was just to make sure it gets cleaned each year and do whatever has to be done to protect your investment to try and make it last longer than 5-10 years.

It has been posted here before that AL 249 C, I believe it is, has the most corrosion resistance, but less of a temperature rating, even though it isn't rated for coal because of the temperature rating. When I read that my thought was, "if coal burns cooler in the exhaust liner than wood, then why is the temp rating a worry in the first place?" Obviously, we all know how hot coal can get, but it's not supposed to get there anyway. Just another reason I am not yet convinced SS liners are the answer for me because of wanting to burn wood and coal. Maybe what I read about AL 249 C was just an opinion and I am wrong. Pictures of rotted 316Ti don't lie though. Some have had great luck with it for years. I hope you do as well because then that might persuade me.

Somehow though I get the impression you'll take care of that chimney as best you can if if the worst happens you'll make adjustments just like we all do.