Newbie With a Simplex Multitherm Boiler
- artbar56
- Member
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu. Nov. 13, 2014 11:15 am
- Location: Oakville (Shippensburg), PA
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Simplex Multitherm CHF-120
- Coal Size/Type: Stove/Hard Coal
Good Evening All,
As I posted in my intro., my name is Art and I'm new to coal and to the boiler. My family and I recently purchased a home from 1853. The house is equipped with a Simplex Multitherm model: CHF-120. Presently, we are using oil but the furnace seems to drink that up fairly quickly. I found a local coal company (Cumberland Valley Coal) and the gentleman sounded knowledgeable. I'm getting a delivery the middle of next week. $234/ton plus $20 delivery of nut-sized medium hardness coal. This was his recommendation. If anyone has ANY helpful hints and tips, I would be grateful (no pun intended). The pictures were taken with my phone. If needed, I can use a regular DSLR for better pics. Thank you all!
As I posted in my intro., my name is Art and I'm new to coal and to the boiler. My family and I recently purchased a home from 1853. The house is equipped with a Simplex Multitherm model: CHF-120. Presently, we are using oil but the furnace seems to drink that up fairly quickly. I found a local coal company (Cumberland Valley Coal) and the gentleman sounded knowledgeable. I'm getting a delivery the middle of next week. $234/ton plus $20 delivery of nut-sized medium hardness coal. This was his recommendation. If anyone has ANY helpful hints and tips, I would be grateful (no pun intended). The pictures were taken with my phone. If needed, I can use a regular DSLR for better pics. Thank you all!
Attachments
Hi Art. check out this link from someone else that has a Simplex Multitherm unit.
Simplex Multitherm
Simplex Multitherm
- Rob R.
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 17977
- Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
- Location: Chazy, NY
- Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 520
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Chubby Jr
You are a first time coal burner? This is quite a beast to start out with. The firebox in this unit is much larger than what most people are used to seeing with stoves. When you shake the ashes down and reload with fresh coal, it is very important that you don't completely cover the fire with fresh coal...always leave some of the burning coal exposed. This burns off the gasses released from the fresh coal, if you do not do this the firebox will fill with gasses and can create an explosion.
On the right side of the unit, is there a chain connected to the damper control? You need to make sure that the chain isn't binding on anything, and the flap it is connected to at the bottom can move freely.
On the right side of the unit, is there a chain connected to the damper control? You need to make sure that the chain isn't binding on anything, and the flap it is connected to at the bottom can move freely.
- StokerDon
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 7486
- Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 11:17 am
- Location: PA, Southern York County!
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Gentleman Janitor GJ-5, Van Wert VA-600, Axeman Anderson130 X3.
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Harman SF3500 reduced down to 3 grates connected to its own plenum
- Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut and whatever will fit through the door on the Harman
- Other Heating: Noth'in but COAL! Well, Maybe a little tiny bit of wood
Welcome to the forum Art!
That's a good sized hand fired boiler you have there, it will keep you warm for a lot less on coal than oil. You will likely have problems when starting out but, you can always get help here.
One very important thing, Do you have CO detectors in the house? Most poeple think you only need them with coal but, they are very important for ANY fuel burning appliance. Things can go wrong with gas and oil heaters as well as coal fired units.
In the one photo, the baro is hanging wide open, I hope the oil burner was running flat out. If not, we need to work on that.
-Don
That's a good sized hand fired boiler you have there, it will keep you warm for a lot less on coal than oil. You will likely have problems when starting out but, you can always get help here.
One very important thing, Do you have CO detectors in the house? Most poeple think you only need them with coal but, they are very important for ANY fuel burning appliance. Things can go wrong with gas and oil heaters as well as coal fired units.
In the one photo, the baro is hanging wide open, I hope the oil burner was running flat out. If not, we need to work on that.
-Don
As our fellow members said, one of us who has this unit would wander by soon enough. And I'm one such guy. You have a good boiler. It has its quirks but its strengths must be respected. I would echo what others have suggested and look at the search option and see what others have posted on this. I think I have posted several on it (and the Kaa-2 Keystoker that replaced it).
After you do that, 'private message' me if you have have more questions. We'll get you warm and save you $ in no time.
Welcome
After you do that, 'private message' me if you have have more questions. We'll get you warm and save you $ in no time.
Welcome
Also, I would reiterate the comments of another member above. This isn't the easiest introduction to coal, but it won't be that hard. A working Baro damper with a real chimney is needed. The Samson flapper control is far from 'air tight' and your boiler will always put out a fair amount of heat. You need to be able to dump it somewhere with an overheat thermostat. (It's probably already set up that way if someone burned coal in it before.) Also, the note about 'explosion' is valid. If you put a bunch of cold coal completely covering a hot bed, methane will crack out of the coal. When the bed is hot enough (and you open the door) it will "poof" in your face. Don't be that guy.
So, in addition to reading all the VanWert Simplex Multitherm posts, for a newbie:
1. If possible, find a buddy with some coal experience at least initially
2. Start a wood fire, get it hot, and spread all the coals out then begin gradually adding coal until it ignites
3. Coal is not wood and does not burn the same. It burns from the bottom but you always need a little "make up" air on top so the volatiles burn
4. You gotta keep the coal spread all across the grates so the air has to travel through the bed (and never around it)
5. It is a complete waste of money to burn oil in it; don't do it. My measured efficiency with oil was around 65%. Go buy an efficient oil or propane boiler for when you're not burning coal. Believe me.
6. Tune the baro damper and Samson draft control together and keep in mind that what you set up for coal will not work for wood. Wood heats up way faster than coal and it needs air in different proportions. A wood fire when starting out has to be absolutely watched. Here's why: when you first fire the boier with solid fuel, it could be cold. That means the 45 gallons of water in it might be 65 degrees. The Samson damper will be wide open at that temperature. A wood fire will rage out of control and burn out your chimney pipes. So, yes, a wood fire in a cold boiler with a damper and baro set for coal is a dangerous situation to leave unattended. So, close the Samson damper and use the one in the door. Once you switch to coal and the boiler is already warm, it will smoothly manage itself.
7. In my 2700 sq ft house in Central NY, the boiler simply made too much heat idling on days where it got into the 40's. This is a "winter" boiler when you need at least some heat all the time. For us, we used oil (in a modern efficient oil boiler) until it got cold then we switched to coal December through March. It was work compared to a stoker, but it worked quite well.
So, in addition to reading all the VanWert Simplex Multitherm posts, for a newbie:
1. If possible, find a buddy with some coal experience at least initially
2. Start a wood fire, get it hot, and spread all the coals out then begin gradually adding coal until it ignites
3. Coal is not wood and does not burn the same. It burns from the bottom but you always need a little "make up" air on top so the volatiles burn
4. You gotta keep the coal spread all across the grates so the air has to travel through the bed (and never around it)
5. It is a complete waste of money to burn oil in it; don't do it. My measured efficiency with oil was around 65%. Go buy an efficient oil or propane boiler for when you're not burning coal. Believe me.
6. Tune the baro damper and Samson draft control together and keep in mind that what you set up for coal will not work for wood. Wood heats up way faster than coal and it needs air in different proportions. A wood fire when starting out has to be absolutely watched. Here's why: when you first fire the boier with solid fuel, it could be cold. That means the 45 gallons of water in it might be 65 degrees. The Samson damper will be wide open at that temperature. A wood fire will rage out of control and burn out your chimney pipes. So, yes, a wood fire in a cold boiler with a damper and baro set for coal is a dangerous situation to leave unattended. So, close the Samson damper and use the one in the door. Once you switch to coal and the boiler is already warm, it will smoothly manage itself.
7. In my 2700 sq ft house in Central NY, the boiler simply made too much heat idling on days where it got into the 40's. This is a "winter" boiler when you need at least some heat all the time. For us, we used oil (in a modern efficient oil boiler) until it got cold then we switched to coal December through March. It was work compared to a stoker, but it worked quite well.
- artbar56
- Member
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu. Nov. 13, 2014 11:15 am
- Location: Oakville (Shippensburg), PA
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Simplex Multitherm CHF-120
- Coal Size/Type: Stove/Hard Coal
Thank you all for the well-wishes and I will answer you all. (Been in Project Management school all week).
Rob R. - Yes, the damper on the side IS connected to a chain to the top 'gizmo" I'm thinking a thermal relief??? and it does move freely and opens the damper at the bottom. Could you tell me what this thing does and what I should look for? Thank you!
Rob R. - Yes, the damper on the side IS connected to a chain to the top 'gizmo" I'm thinking a thermal relief??? and it does move freely and opens the damper at the bottom. Could you tell me what this thing does and what I should look for? Thank you!
- lsayre
- Member
- Posts: 21781
- Joined: Wed. Nov. 23, 2005 9:17 pm
- Location: Ohio
- Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
- Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Anthracite Pea
- Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (13.5 KW), ComfortMax 75
The chain "thingy" sounds like a Sampson Control, which is the solid fuel boiler equivalent of a bimetallic damper (bimetallic air inlet control) on a coal or wood stove. When the water begins to get colder it opens progressively to allow additional air in to feed the fire, and when the water gets hotter it progressively closes to shut down air feed and cool down the fire. Its job is to maintain a fairly steady water temperature.
- Sting
- Member
- Posts: 2983
- Joined: Mon. Feb. 25, 2008 4:24 pm
- Location: Lower Fox Valley = Wisconsin
- Other Heating: OBSO Lennox Pulse "Air Scorcher" burning NG
In another thread I found the best way to light my stoves - it takes a little more time - but wow its ez and smoke free
Not my Idea - this is from others smarter than me
first I took a pc of cardboard about the size of the stove floor grates and cut a 4 inch hole in the center
I put that on the clean fire box floor and over the hole=
I took a 4 inch stove pipe and set it in the center of the stove fire pot - and filled the pipe with charcoal
then filled [around the charcoal filled pipe] the rest of the fire box with coal
at this point I gracefully withdraw the piece of smoke pipe and the charcoal "chimney' remains in the center of the fuel
I dumped some match lite on the charcoal - opened up the ash door - lit the charcoal - closed the load door
AND WALKED AWAY so I wouldn't open the load door till I felt the heat
When it was hot I had a nice bed of hot coal - again no smoke in the room - just cheery heat
Kind Regards
Sting
Not my Idea - this is from others smarter than me
first I took a pc of cardboard about the size of the stove floor grates and cut a 4 inch hole in the center
I put that on the clean fire box floor and over the hole=
I took a 4 inch stove pipe and set it in the center of the stove fire pot - and filled the pipe with charcoal
then filled [around the charcoal filled pipe] the rest of the fire box with coal
at this point I gracefully withdraw the piece of smoke pipe and the charcoal "chimney' remains in the center of the fuel
I dumped some match lite on the charcoal - opened up the ash door - lit the charcoal - closed the load door
AND WALKED AWAY so I wouldn't open the load door till I felt the heat
When it was hot I had a nice bed of hot coal - again no smoke in the room - just cheery heat
Kind Regards
Sting
The "thingy" is the Samson D5 draft control. The description above is correct: the water temperature causes a closed component inside to expand or contract. It pushes on a spring-wrapped piston to raise or lower the draft control arm.
If it ever breaks, the inside components are replaceable without removing the unit from the boiler.
The control has both white and red numbers on it. They are in Celsius, not Fahrenheit. The colors correspond to whether the unit is vertical or horizontal.
Remember, once the unit is calibrated to your boiler with coal, it will control a burning unit quite well. But it is NOT for a cold start or when burning wood.
If it ever breaks, the inside components are replaceable without removing the unit from the boiler.
The control has both white and red numbers on it. They are in Celsius, not Fahrenheit. The colors correspond to whether the unit is vertical or horizontal.
Remember, once the unit is calibrated to your boiler with coal, it will control a burning unit quite well. But it is NOT for a cold start or when burning wood.
- artbar56
- Member
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu. Nov. 13, 2014 11:15 am
- Location: Oakville (Shippensburg), PA
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Simplex Multitherm CHF-120
- Coal Size/Type: Stove/Hard Coal
StokerDon,
Yes, at the time the picture was taken, I was running oil. I got my delivery of coal today and I think I finally have this thing working. I DO appreciate the help!
Thank you,
Art
Yes, at the time the picture was taken, I was running oil. I got my delivery of coal today and I think I finally have this thing working. I DO appreciate the help!
Thank you,
Art
- Rob R.
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 17977
- Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
- Location: Chazy, NY
- Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 520
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Chubby Jr
You will be warm and cozy when you get that thing burning anthracite...much more consistent than the oil burner. Just be sure to keep a close eye on it when you first get it fired up, make sure it doesn't overfire.
Is there a second aquastat installed to activate a dump zone?
One more thing, your stove pipe should have three screws per joint.
Is there a second aquastat installed to activate a dump zone?
One more thing, your stove pipe should have three screws per joint.
- artbar56
- Member
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Thu. Nov. 13, 2014 11:15 am
- Location: Oakville (Shippensburg), PA
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Simplex Multitherm CHF-120
- Coal Size/Type: Stove/Hard Coal
Hey Rob R.
I have a PM sent off to another user for some answers. Getting this coal going is kind of frustrating right now. This afternoon I was in class and wife tried getting it going. Wood fire went well. There were plenty of red coals so wifey put on a few small (coal bucket shovels) shovel fulls of coal. She seemed to smother it. When I got home, I shook the grates and almost all coal was unburned. Unfortunately for me, the same thing seems to be happening. I did cut plenty of wood this weekend so I informed my wife, "If I have to burn every stick on this property, we are NOT going to freeze tonight".
Right now, I brought the wood fire back up. I'm going to get that thing blazing before I put more coal on. 15ºF is the wrong time to "learn coal".
Anyway, for you or anyone else...
1) the spinner dampers on the doors...open or closed or somewhere in between?
2) The damper on the side (sorry, I don't have the terminology yet) with the chain...open closed or, as someone else mentioned, calibrated for coal?
3) the flue damper (I was told by HVAC guy that it's so smoke doesn't come back down on windy days) I notice that it has a variable weight. #2 and the damper is almost all the way closed, #8 and it's almost wide open...where should this be for coal?
If you or anyone have any suggestions...other than,"Dear God, the dude is gonna' die" I would REALLY appreciate it! I really do appreciate all your help and in retrospect, one day I WILL look back at this and laugh...just NOT tonight! Thank you!
I have a PM sent off to another user for some answers. Getting this coal going is kind of frustrating right now. This afternoon I was in class and wife tried getting it going. Wood fire went well. There were plenty of red coals so wifey put on a few small (coal bucket shovels) shovel fulls of coal. She seemed to smother it. When I got home, I shook the grates and almost all coal was unburned. Unfortunately for me, the same thing seems to be happening. I did cut plenty of wood this weekend so I informed my wife, "If I have to burn every stick on this property, we are NOT going to freeze tonight".
Right now, I brought the wood fire back up. I'm going to get that thing blazing before I put more coal on. 15ºF is the wrong time to "learn coal".
Anyway, for you or anyone else...
1) the spinner dampers on the doors...open or closed or somewhere in between?
2) The damper on the side (sorry, I don't have the terminology yet) with the chain...open closed or, as someone else mentioned, calibrated for coal?
3) the flue damper (I was told by HVAC guy that it's so smoke doesn't come back down on windy days) I notice that it has a variable weight. #2 and the damper is almost all the way closed, #8 and it's almost wide open...where should this be for coal?
If you or anyone have any suggestions...other than,"Dear God, the dude is gonna' die" I would REALLY appreciate it! I really do appreciate all your help and in retrospect, one day I WILL look back at this and laugh...just NOT tonight! Thank you!
- Rob R.
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 17977
- Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
- Location: Chazy, NY
- Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM 520
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Chubby Jr
Open the spinners one turn or so.
Damper on the side should be controlled by the control connect to the chain...this should be set at 180F or so.
The damper you referred to is a barometric draft control, set the weight at the #5 mark.
Damper on the side should be controlled by the control connect to the chain...this should be set at 180F or so.
The damper you referred to is a barometric draft control, set the weight at the #5 mark.