coal gun burning bituminous coal

 
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lsayre
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Post by lsayre » Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 8:20 am

Rob R. wrote:
Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 7:13 am
Bituminous coal can vary WIDELY in how it burns. I am sure there is some bit. out there that would eagerly burn into the hopper on an AHS. Think about this - even equipment made to burn bit. coal can only burn some of it. The volatile content, AFT, coke index, etc all make a big difference.
I agree! It seems that the potential risk of burning bit in a Coal Gun should outweigh the reward.

 
PatInMontana
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Post by PatInMontana » Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 10:33 am

the potential risk of burning bit in a Coal Gun should outweigh the reward.
I'm an admitted newbie when it comes to coal, as I've only been at this a year. Don't know the difference between sub-bit and bit, and never experienced any PA Anthracite. Honestly, talk about "volatiles" is beyond my understanding. At first I was worried what might happen if the fire crept into the hopper. But I had mitigated the risk as best I could when I built the system - the shed housing the coal gun is 20 feet from the house, clearances to the walls are all in line, etc.
The system worked great for the first couple months before the first hopper "fire". But a year into it, I don't worry too much about it. I'd like it to work better, but now I just deal with the glow in the hopper when it happens. Have to check it often - 4 or 5 times per day of late, but it definitely has been worse with this last jag of coal I brought home. I feel like it's no more "risk" than my previous system - Wood Gun in the basement of the house. That was a mean heat machine, but it had it's risks too - way more blowbacks and puffing, sometimes throwing sparks out the air intake or past the door seals.
The hopper fires I've had amount to some red burning coals above the inlet tube. I poke them down via the feed tube/hopper and settle the pile through the site flap, pulling the rest of the burning coal out of the tube and carry on. It's not a raging inferno by any means. My theory is that some of the reason for the fire creeping into the hopper is due to the amount of air that's able to enter via the hopper and the auger connection. I recently sealed that up as best I could, but there's still a fair amount that's able to get past. Perhaps with no auger hole the lid would better seal and most of the air would come from the bottom as it should. Actually thought about adding a slide gate under the auger hole.
Izaharis idea is interesting as well:
if closing off either one third or one half the throat of the coal inlet would be worth pursuing
- it wouldn't be hard to try that. And this idea of open / auger, no hopper is worth a try - I can experiment with that manually.
I've also yet to check my stack draft - the manometer just arrived yesterday so this weekend I'll be able to see how hard the it is pulling. I don't expect there's going to be a lot, as the stack is only about 10' of pipe, and no bends - very similar to Joes setup from the first video - and he ended up removing his automatic damper (I have it sitting in the corner now).
If there's a way to "farmer-ize" it, count me in! I'm not quite ready to take a loss on this system and switch to the Prill.
Pat

 
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lsayre
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Post by lsayre » Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 10:54 am

Hopper fires are precisely the reason why AHS told me burning bit coal is strictly taboo. The risk of carbon monoxide poisoning and fire is not worth it. The hopper is not made to contain fire.

 
PatInMontana
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Post by PatInMontana » Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 11:00 am

carbon monoxide poisoning
Yep, it will put smoke in the shed, no way I'd want it in my house. If the fan is running, it draws all smoke out the stack, but on idle you don't want to shut the door and hang out there if it's smoldering in the bin.


 
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lsayre
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Joined: Wed. Nov. 23, 2005 9:17 pm
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Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (13.5 KW), ComfortMax 75

Post by lsayre » Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 11:01 am

PatInMontana wrote:
Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 11:00 am
Yep, it will put smoke in the shed, no way I'd want it in my house. If the fan is running, it draws all smoke out the stack, but on idle you don't want to shut the door and hang out there if it's smoldering in the bin.
Is the risk you are taking worth it. Carbon Monoxide is colorless and odorless. It doesn't require smoke to be present. And it can kill quickly.

 
lzaharis
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Post by lzaharis » Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 11:20 am

Hello Pat,

The more I think about this now the more I am sure the prill stokers were used in the iron fireman coal stoker boilers and coal furnaces.

Pat would it be worth your time to buy a small load of the sub bit that Joseph burns from his mine to try it before you sideline the S130?

I guess at worst you would have to heat the base of the grain bin with a water coil to keep the coal flowing.
He has an enclosed coal bin next to the boiler room now and he is feeding the hopper manually with an auger and then he puts the hopper lid back after its filled and the hopper load lasts a day or day and a half if I remember right.

His coal ash is very fine powder and and it barely has any clinkers and he apparently has little if any smoke to deal with in the boiler room.

Leon

 
PatInMontana
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Location: Central Montana
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130
Coal Size/Type: Sub Bit - Signal Peak Mine, Roundup MT
Other Heating: Wood Propane

Post by PatInMontana » Fri. Dec. 11, 2020 11:35 am

Regarding CO2 - Been there done that, many years ago running a gas powered concrete saw in a basement! Dad and I both got sick after about 45 minutes. Never do that again. With this setup I don't spend much time in there, and when I do the door and window are open wide. Pretty limited exposure. I might get worse from warming up my dirty-max diesel pickup - it's got one cylinder with low compression, and until it gets up to temp the visible smoke is far worse than the coal gun. LOL :) - the mosquito mitigator!

Any heat source based on combustion be it coal, wood, propane, nat gas is far safer in a separate building. Already this winter a couple kids in western Montana died in a house with a malfunctioning gas furnace. Now that I've made the investment to have the burn outside I'll never go back. House is cleaner, wife is happier, and we won't die in our sleep! Even if I someday end up with a propane boiler to replace the coal, that's where it will be.

I was thinking about getting a little load from down at Joe's source too - it's actually on the way to look at the Prill. And next chance I get I'm going to stop at the supplier in Roundup and see if they have mitigated the fines issue. I'm probably not the only customer of theirs having issues - that much fines has to cause an issue for anyone running an auger / screw type feed (like the Prill, etc). Their supply hasn't been like this in the past - I got some clean loads last season (90% between 1/2" and 2" ), had no issue with the fire creeping up - in fact it worked like a top.

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