Flumoxed by Efel Harmony III Clearance Instructions
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Hi Folks,
I have an Efel Harmony III I purchased for installation in a new log cabin I have in VT. I purchased it in fall of 2015 new from a dealer. It was manufactured in 2012 according to the plate on the back. I had it installed by my General Contractor who is very conscientious about doing things right. Plus I kept an eye on what he did with regard to clearances and a pad for underneath. Left/Right/Top clearances are not in question. It is a rear exhaust, hopper fed coal stove with a double-walled pipe. the stove has a heat shield on the back. The wall behind the stove is cedar tongue & groove wood.
On start up of the stove the over evening, it got much hotter than I run it when idling along to keep the house warm. The wall behind was quite warm, but I could still keep my hand flat on it without getting burned or having to withdraw with pain. Nonetheless, this made me want to re-check the clearances. My understanding is the clearances on the plate on the back of the stove should be considered gospel for a certified stove, yes? The clearances on the back plate for a double-walled installation are 10" from the back of the stove to a combustible surface. My installation is 10" from the wall to the double-walled pipe (rear exit) and 18" to the back of the stove; so I'm well beyond recommended minimums and code says anything over six inches clearance is OK for a double-walled pipe. HERE'S THE PROBLEM!
The paper manual, shows a line drawing for clearances showing a top exhaust stove (impossible for this stove being hopper fed from the top). Not only does this drawing contradict the reality of the stove, it also defines the minimum clearance for the top exhaust pipe to the back wall to be 13", and the minimum clearance from the stove back to the wall to be 24". Yes! The two dimensions are an impossible contradiction. I'm guessing this is my ignorance and it's just industry standard to show the drawing this way and it's just defining minimum distance, pipe to wall? The manual only shows single wall pipe installation and offers no account for double walled installations.
You might say, "Just go with the back plate!" Here's another aspect that confounds me: On the back plate, reading the text above the dimensions, it instructs "This is a solid fuel, wood burning stove Only." Go figure! It has a hopper, a knifing port in the front, an ash pan, and a bottom, thermostatic damper. Looks like a coal stove to me! The manual specifically says it is NOT a dual fuel stove, coal only, despite the door on the right side. I had the identical stove back in the '80s and it was sold as a dual fuel.
Maybe my confusion is based on my ignorance. I called the dealer and they are trying to get an answer from their distributor; not a very encouraging response. They are clueless.
I'd really appreciate any help you might offer. Thanks!
I have an Efel Harmony III I purchased for installation in a new log cabin I have in VT. I purchased it in fall of 2015 new from a dealer. It was manufactured in 2012 according to the plate on the back. I had it installed by my General Contractor who is very conscientious about doing things right. Plus I kept an eye on what he did with regard to clearances and a pad for underneath. Left/Right/Top clearances are not in question. It is a rear exhaust, hopper fed coal stove with a double-walled pipe. the stove has a heat shield on the back. The wall behind the stove is cedar tongue & groove wood.
On start up of the stove the over evening, it got much hotter than I run it when idling along to keep the house warm. The wall behind was quite warm, but I could still keep my hand flat on it without getting burned or having to withdraw with pain. Nonetheless, this made me want to re-check the clearances. My understanding is the clearances on the plate on the back of the stove should be considered gospel for a certified stove, yes? The clearances on the back plate for a double-walled installation are 10" from the back of the stove to a combustible surface. My installation is 10" from the wall to the double-walled pipe (rear exit) and 18" to the back of the stove; so I'm well beyond recommended minimums and code says anything over six inches clearance is OK for a double-walled pipe. HERE'S THE PROBLEM!
The paper manual, shows a line drawing for clearances showing a top exhaust stove (impossible for this stove being hopper fed from the top). Not only does this drawing contradict the reality of the stove, it also defines the minimum clearance for the top exhaust pipe to the back wall to be 13", and the minimum clearance from the stove back to the wall to be 24". Yes! The two dimensions are an impossible contradiction. I'm guessing this is my ignorance and it's just industry standard to show the drawing this way and it's just defining minimum distance, pipe to wall? The manual only shows single wall pipe installation and offers no account for double walled installations.
You might say, "Just go with the back plate!" Here's another aspect that confounds me: On the back plate, reading the text above the dimensions, it instructs "This is a solid fuel, wood burning stove Only." Go figure! It has a hopper, a knifing port in the front, an ash pan, and a bottom, thermostatic damper. Looks like a coal stove to me! The manual specifically says it is NOT a dual fuel stove, coal only, despite the door on the right side. I had the identical stove back in the '80s and it was sold as a dual fuel.
Maybe my confusion is based on my ignorance. I called the dealer and they are trying to get an answer from their distributor; not a very encouraging response. They are clueless.
I'd really appreciate any help you might offer. Thanks!
- warminmn
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I used to use a twin to your stove, called many different names, but mine a Bayard with a fancy cast iron top. I had mine at an angle to my wall and will admit I was just a couple inches from my double heat shield and the wall never got warm, much less hot. Those distances on the stove are before using a heat shield on the wall, and really, you should install a heat shield of some type on a wood wall, for sparks if nothing else. There are some nice looking heat shields you can make, it doesnt have to be ugly. Tin, painted cement board, etc.
My stove was a NOS stove from the 80's I think. Ive got my manual somewhere, not sure where.
My stove was a NOS stove from the 80's I think. Ive got my manual somewhere, not sure where.
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Good thought, but not the case. The floor model I looked at when I bought it had the same plate, as did mine, as did the one on the floor they looked at in the store yesterday. Maybe they put the wrong one on a whole production run...SWPaDon wrote:I'm thinking someone accidently put the wrong plate on it.
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I don't disagree with regards to the wall shield. Even if I've got the necessary spacing, for extra safety it's a good idea. You did hit the mark on the appearance; It's a very nice, new log home, not like hunting camp where any rugged look would be fine. I need to do some thinking on that...warminmn wrote:I used to use a twin to your stove, called many different names, but mine a Bayard with a fancy cast iron top. I had mine at an angle to my wall and will admit I was just a couple inches from my double heat shield and the wall never got warm, much less hot. Those distances on the stove are before using a heat shield on the wall, and really, you should install a heat shield of some type on a wood wall, for sparks if nothing else. There are some nice looking heat shields you can make, it doesnt have to be ugly. Tin, painted cement board, etc.
My stove was a NOS stove from the 80's I think. Ive got my manual somewhere, not sure where.
thanks.
- warminmn
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- Other Heating: Wood and wear a wool shirt
This will take an hour to look at, but might give you some ideas. Pictures of Your Stove I'm sure you can google for pics too. There should be a custom shop around to make anything you can dream up. It doesnt have to be high heat paint unless real close.
- SWPaDon
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Do they drug test employees?Ossa wrote:Good thought, but not the case. The floor model I looked at when I bought it had the same plate, as did mine, as did the one on the floor they looked at in the store yesterday. Maybe they put the wrong one on a whole production run...SWPaDon wrote:I'm thinking someone accidently put the wrong plate on it.
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Without knowing what the other finishes are they do make light weight stone looking randome size tiles for a better word but the look like a hand laid up wall when done with all odd shapes if you like. If you like a brick look they make lightweight brick tiles that are actual red brick and easy to install as well. Obviously over cement board for either choice spaced off the wall a minimum of 1 inch.
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The confusion over dual fuel is because of EPA rules. It no longer can be called a wood stove.
If the wood wall is on the edge of being too warm, I would put a heat shield there. Over time with steady heat the wood will combust at lower temperatures than normal. A bottom heat shield is a good idea too.
If the wood wall is on the edge of being too warm, I would put a heat shield there. Over time with steady heat the wood will combust at lower temperatures than normal. A bottom heat shield is a good idea too.
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That makes sense regarding the EPA being at the root of the confusion.franco b wrote:The confusion over dual fuel is because of EPA rules. It no longer can be called a wood stove.
If the wood wall is on the edge of being too warm, I would put a heat shield there. Over time with steady heat the wood will combust at lower temperatures than normal. A bottom heat shield is a good idea too.
Thanks to you and the previous poster as well for input on the heat shield. I've started to look around already. I like some that I've seen that are the requisite 24 guage metal (NFPA 211 requirement...), are black and are laser cut with designs at the top to be attractive.
I'm still hoping someone might have some input on the clearance requirements...
- warminmn
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- Joined: Tue. Feb. 08, 2011 5:59 pm
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- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Chubby Junior, Riteway 37
- Coal Size/Type: nut and stove anthracite, lignite
- Other Heating: Wood and wear a wool shirt
Its way to cold for me to look at my stove as its in an outbuilding, but I'll take a pic of the label in 2 or 3 days that shows what my clearances were. Adding a heat shield will cut the distance almost in half.
You can always remove the heat shield when the stove is not in use, as long as you remember to put it back on when burning.
You can always remove the heat shield when the stove is not in use, as long as you remember to put it back on when burning.
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- Posts: 37
- Joined: Sat. Dec. 17, 2016 12:28 pm
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Efel Harmony III
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Thanks! I'll look forward to anything you can offer!warminmn wrote:Its way to cold for me to look at my stove as its in an outbuilding, but I'll take a pic of the label in 2 or 3 days that shows what my clearances were. Adding a heat shield will cut the distance almost in half.
You can always remove the heat shield when the stove is not in use, as long as you remember to put it back on when burning.