K4 fire keeps going out
I installed a k4 keystoker about 4 weeks ago. It ran perfect up until the past week. The fire stayed lit even on those very warm days. Now that the temps have dropped outside the fire keeps going out. I bumped the feed rate up in hopes that would help and it did not. Any suggestions?
- StokerDon
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- Stoker Coal Boiler: Gentleman Janitor GJ-5, Van Wert VA-600, Axeman Anderson130 X3.
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- Other Heating: Noth'in but COAL! Well, Maybe a little tiny bit of wood
What does the fire look like, does it look like it is feeding enough? You might have something stuck in the bottom of the hopper.
If it ran well in the warm temps, we can probably rule out timer problems or missing timer cycles while on the high limit.
Is it still maintaining a good draft?
-Don
If it ran well in the warm temps, we can probably rule out timer problems or missing timer cycles while on the high limit.
Is it still maintaining a good draft?
-Don
- StokerDon
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 7496
- Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 11:17 am
- Location: PA, Southern York County!
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Gentleman Janitor GJ-5, Van Wert VA-600, Axeman Anderson130 X3.
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Harman SF3500 reduced down to 3 grates connected to its own plenum
- Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut and whatever will fit through the door on the Harman
- Other Heating: Noth'in but COAL! Well, Maybe a little tiny bit of wood
That is perplexing. Is it still maintaining a good draft? Something might have happened to your chimney.
-Don
-Don
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- Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KAA-4-1 dual fuel boiler
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AH yes;
What size coal are you burning? if you have 6 inches of coal burning that is too much you should have no more than 2-3 inches of coal burning at the most.
Did you lift the baffle plate off in front of the flue breech to see how much ash had parked there?
Keystoker made no mention of this in the owners manual of the baffle plate being removable when I purchased my KAA-4-1 three years ago.
You need to check and see how much ash is built up under the fire grate if the fire has been going out too as a lot of rice coal fines will pass through the air holes.
Set your hold fire timer pins to run with the following:
3 minutes at zero time
2 minutes at 7 minutes
3 minutes at 15 minutes
2 minutes at 22 minutes
DON'T FOOL with the timer too much; if you do it will wear out the timer motor prematurely
Start with 5 threads out, start your fire and then you should back it off to 6 threads and then 7 then 8 eventually to 9 threads out like mine and it works.
After that you will have 2 inches of ash, 2 inches of fire and 3 plus inches of unburned coal.
I leave my KAA-4-1 at summer operating temperatures 140 low 160 high with 190 as a dump zone temperature and it works fine with 225+ feet of 3/4" fin tube baseboard which I hate anyway but it works.
What size coal are you burning? if you have 6 inches of coal burning that is too much you should have no more than 2-3 inches of coal burning at the most.
Did you lift the baffle plate off in front of the flue breech to see how much ash had parked there?
Keystoker made no mention of this in the owners manual of the baffle plate being removable when I purchased my KAA-4-1 three years ago.
You need to check and see how much ash is built up under the fire grate if the fire has been going out too as a lot of rice coal fines will pass through the air holes.
Set your hold fire timer pins to run with the following:
3 minutes at zero time
2 minutes at 7 minutes
3 minutes at 15 minutes
2 minutes at 22 minutes
DON'T FOOL with the timer too much; if you do it will wear out the timer motor prematurely
Start with 5 threads out, start your fire and then you should back it off to 6 threads and then 7 then 8 eventually to 9 threads out like mine and it works.
After that you will have 2 inches of ash, 2 inches of fire and 3 plus inches of unburned coal.
I leave my KAA-4-1 at summer operating temperatures 140 low 160 high with 190 as a dump zone temperature and it works fine with 225+ feet of 3/4" fin tube baseboard which I hate anyway but it works.
I’m assuming it has good draft. The pipe is warm throughout it.
The timer that is on my boiler is an old Honeywell timer. Probably the original that came on my boiler. It doesn’t have pins to set.
I seem to think the fire is burning up the shoot too far, which is causing some burnt coal. Then when the fan turns off and the fire dies down it has a hard time burning that coal after the fan turns back on. A few cycles of that and the fire eventually goes out. Does that make sense?
The timer that is on my boiler is an old Honeywell timer. Probably the original that came on my boiler. It doesn’t have pins to set.
I seem to think the fire is burning up the shoot too far, which is causing some burnt coal. Then when the fan turns off and the fire dies down it has a hard time burning that coal after the fan turns back on. A few cycles of that and the fire eventually goes out. Does that make sense?
- McGiever
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- Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Leon, Don't think this is a KAA-4, but rather a KA-4, so not a "clone" of yours.lzaharis wrote: ↑Wed. Nov. 14, 2018 8:21 pmAH yes;
What size coal are you burning? if you have 6 inches of coal burning that is too much you should have no more than 2-3 inches of coal burning at the most.
Did you lift the baffle plate off in front of the flue breech to see how much ash had parked there?
Keystoker made no mention of this in the owners manual of the baffle plate being removable when I purchased my KAA-4-1 three years ago.
You need to check and see how much ash is built up under the fire grate if the fire has been going out too as a lot of rice coal fines will pass through the air holes.
Set your hold fire timer pins to run with the following:
3 minutes at zero time
2 minutes at 7 minutes
3 minutes at 15 minutes
2 minutes at 22 minutes
DON'T FOOL with the timer too much; if you do it will wear out the timer motor prematurely
Start with 5 threads out, start your fire and then you should back it off to 6 threads and then 7 then 8 eventually to 9 threads out like mine and it works.
After that you will have 2 inches of ash, 2 inches of fire and 3 plus inches of unburned coal.
I leave my KAA-4-1 at summer operating temperatures 140 low 160 high with 190 as a dump zone temperature and it works fine with 225+ feet of 3/4" fin tube baseboard which I hate anyway but it works.
- McGiever
- Member
- Posts: 10130
- Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
- Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV
- Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
- Coal Size/Type: PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE
- Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
- StokerDon
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 7496
- Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 11:17 am
- Location: PA, Southern York County!
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Gentleman Janitor GJ-5, Van Wert VA-600, Axeman Anderson130 X3.
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Harman SF3500 reduced down to 3 grates connected to its own plenum
- Coal Size/Type: Rice, Chestnut and whatever will fit through the door on the Harman
- Other Heating: Noth'in but COAL! Well, Maybe a little tiny bit of wood
If you only have 2-3 inches of burning coal at full fire your feed rate is set too low.
You have to measure draft with a manometer, you can't feel it.
No it doesn't. The fire should always be migrating down the grate, not up it. This could also indicate a draft problem. If all of the combustion gas can't get out the chimney, it will try to go out the hopper, dragging the fire with it.tyscon wrote: ↑Wed. Nov. 14, 2018 8:41 pmI seem to think the fire is burning up the shoot too far, which is causing some burnt coal. Then when the fan turns off and the fire dies down it has a hard time burning that coal after the fan turns back on. A few cycles of that and the fire eventually goes out. Does that make sense?
Please check your draft and your chimney.
-Don
- McGiever
- Member
- Posts: 10130
- Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
- Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV
- Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
- Coal Size/Type: PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE
- Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Leon had a good point of checking and cleaning out dust and coal fines from under the perforated grate. Check the grate holes while you can too.
You can sometimes go in for the dust and coal fines with a reduced vacuum hose size through the rear of the stoker blower to clean out under there.
You can sometimes go in for the dust and coal fines with a reduced vacuum hose size through the rear of the stoker blower to clean out under there.