Boiler fill valve, leave open, or leave closed?

 
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lsayre
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Post by lsayre » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 9:56 am

I've always left mine open, but on another forum I came across discussions where a slight majority advised to leave it closed. Some even stated that some boiler fill valve manufacturer's instructions advise to leave it closed once the pressurized system is purged of air. With it closed one needs to monitor pressure regularly as part of their routine. What say ye?


 
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Lightning
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Post by Lightning » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:03 am

I'm not real educated about boilers but I'm guessing there is some kind of regulator that maintains a particular pressure on the boiler? What happens if it fails?

 
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Post by StokerDon » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:10 am

Larry,
I assume we are talking about boilers fitted with auto fill valves. In that case, shutting the valve that goes to the auto fill valve defeats the purpose.

I don't use auto fill valves. I honestly can't go a full day without looking at the temp and pressure of my boilers though.

-Don

 
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lsayre
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Post by lsayre » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:18 am

Yes, I'm discussing systems with regulators meant to automatically maintain boiler pressure at some preset level.

One of the mfg's who's instructions were noted as instructing to leave the water fill line valve closed was B&G. I don't have a B&G fill valve system so I can't verify this.

As an experiment I just closed off the water supply to my fill valve. I'll be keeping an eye on it.

 
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Post by StokerDon » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:22 am

lsayre wrote:
Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:18 am
Yes, I'm discussing systems with regulators meant to automatically maintain boiler pressure at some preset level.

One of the mfg's who's instructions were noted as instructing to leave the water fill line valve closed was B&G. I don't have a B&G fill valve system so I can't verify this.

As an experiment I just closed off the water supply to my fill valve.
Then this is a really good question because it doesn't make any sense to shut off an automatic control. Hopefully someone will come up with the answer.

-Don

 
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Post by McGiever » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:27 am

:idea: Our beloved member *Sting* has discussed or mentioned this subject in prior discussions. :idea:

 
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Post by bradludwig » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:27 am

The book pumping away describes the senerio where location of pump and location of fill pipe can result in pressure increase over time. I am having this issue now so I have shut off fill valve until I repipe again. Should have bought book first!


 
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Post by lsayre » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:33 am

Lightning wrote:
Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:03 am
I'm not real educated about boilers but I'm guessing there is some kind of regulator that maintains a particular pressure on the boiler? What happens if it fails?
Two negative things initially pop into my mind regarding what can happen if it fails:

1) Boiler over pressures and pops the relief valve. This one would be quite easily recognizable.

2) Boiler very slowly seeps its absolutely filthy (and potentially chemical ladened) water into the homes DW supply over time, but no one ever recognizes it because at the same time the auto-fill system is actually keeping the fill pressure where it should be.

 
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Post by lsayre » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:33 am

McGiever wrote:
Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:27 am
:idea: Our beloved member *Sting* has discussed or mentioned this subject in prior discussions. :idea:
Link? Or alternately, what did he conclude?

 
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Post by McGiever » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 10:39 am

Fill valve pressure regulator valve failure alone cannot flow water back into domestic water supply when a single or double check valve is inline ahead of the fill valve as per code or standard practice. ;)

 
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Post by lzaharis » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 11:05 am

lsayre wrote:
Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 9:56 am
I've always left mine open, but on another forum I came across discussions where a slight majority advised to leave it closed. Some even stated that some boiler fill valve manufacturer's instructions advise to leave it closed once the pressurized system is purged of air. With it closed one needs to monitor pressure regularly as part of their routine. What say ye?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I leave the fresh water feed ball valve off and the pressure regulator valve shut off and with the back flow preventer.

In my system using the steel compression tank with ten gallons of water and a five gallon air blanket on it I have no problems.

If your low water cut off valve is working correctly you boiler is protected.

I have a McDonnell & Miller Guard Dog RB-122-E Low Water Cut Off wired in as my first boiler control.
In this way it will kill the power to the boiler completely in the event the conductivity sensor no longer senses water in the steam chest. B+G recommends that the LWCO can be placed in close boiler piping in the following manner.

1. horizontal in boiler side. (this how I have it in my KAA-4-1).

2. horizontal in a boiler riser pipe.

3. vertical in header pipe.

4. horizontal in header pipe

B+G recommends having two of them with steam boilers or hot water boiler systems with 1,000,000 BTU or larger for a second redundant layer of protection for the boiler.

MY OEM Hydrolevel 3250 Plus from Keystoker failed in that respect and the second one keystoker provided failed when I was running the boiler on oil to test it and I was just standing there and the low water cut off function that was activated turned itself off.

After that I installed a new low water cut off and a honeywell mechanical triple aquastat.
Last edited by lzaharis on Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 3:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

 
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Post by lsayre » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 11:12 am

I have the check valve on the fill water line before my pressure regulating fill valve. Looks like I should open the water valve back up. No pressure changes are being witnessed while having it closed.

 
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Post by windyhill4.2 » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 11:21 am

on wet systems that I monitor - I NEVER leave the auto fill on
Low water cut offs are also prone to fail in the run position so I leave them in the box
but then I am taking care custody and control of the pressure - and some systems may/will vary by season demand
if I were not on site for days at a time - well thats different
guess I have had to clean up too many times due to others

so = It Depends! You do what your comfortable with
When you turn your boiler on -Does it return the favor?
I have finally lost my mind. Don't bother to return it. It wasn't working properly anyway!
TOP
This was the response from Sting in my thread From OWB to EFM520 Installed in Truck Box page 14

 
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Post by windyhill4.2 » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 11:21 am

windyhill4.2 wrote:
Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 11:21 am
From Sting...
on wet systems that I monitor - I NEVER leave the auto fill on
Low water cut offs are also prone to fail in the run position so I leave them in the box
but then I am taking care custody and control of the pressure - and some systems may/will vary by season demand
if I were not on site for days at a time - well thats different
guess I have had to clean up too many times due to others

so = It Depends! You do what your comfortable with
When you turn your boiler on -Does it return the favor?
I have finally lost my mind. Don't bother to return it. It wasn't working properly anyway!
TOP
This was the response from Sting in my thread From OWB to EFM520 Installed in Truck Box page 14

 
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Post by windyhill4.2 » Sat. Jan. 27, 2018 11:24 am

I have no auto-fill valve in my system,i just monitor pressure & when it drops to around 6 PSI, i hook a hose to an inlet in my shop & add water to get the PSI up to around 12-16 #.


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