LL AA-220 Relocation

lzaharis
Member
Posts: 1603
Joined: Sun. Mar. 25, 2007 8:41 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KAA-4-1 dual fuel boiler
Coal Size/Type: rice/buck mix
Other Heating: kerosene for dual fuel Keystoker/unused
Location: Ithaca, New York

Post By: lzaharis » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 11:29 am

Hello and good morning swyman,

I need to caution you about breaking through the gable end of the roof as flashing deteriorates quickly as in a been there done that moment with my place as the previous owner was not one to spend money.

Over time the heavy flashing will break down and leak in to the roof and cause water damage.

You may want to consider doing it this way which is the only right thing that was done with my chimney besides my installing the chimney extension.

My 16 foot tall 8" by 12" tile lined chimney is a stand off chimney where it is held in place to reduce wind load on it as it is exposed by a long weldment that is lag bolted to the end wall of the eave of my home.
The chimney rests on the slab on grade pour with a shallow footer for the back room addition which was their "summer kitchen room".

When you sink a foundation slab or block with a rebar cage in it to strengthen the slab or foundation block as is done with crank up antenna masts or water pumping windmills you need to go really deep.

If at all possible; It would be worth your while to build a stand off chimney with one or more weldments bolted to the wall of the home to hold the chimney in place with strap iron formed to hold the 8 by 12 block and connected to the tube steel weldment that is welded to the plate that is lag bolted to several exterior studs.

Doing it in this way avoids breaking through your new roof and gable end and prevents any possible water damage to the roof on the gable end or on the long wall side of the home.

The mason/carpenter you hire will have to remove some siding to install the lag bolts and blocks and reattach the remaining siding after the lag bolts are put in place with the wooden blocks that cross at least 2 studs to help in anchoring the weldment to the side of the home.

Perhaps paying an architect for an hour of his or her time for this is a good investment as it will be properly designed to prevent problems from occurring from wind loads and any possible water damage if you can take advantage of a stand off block chimney.

My chimney cleanout is outside as I have no basement.

Visit Alternate Heating Sytems

User avatar
McGiever
Member
Posts: 7933
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 11:43 am

Sorry for your misfortune, izzy,
I'll bet no other member here has ever seen such a chimney built as you described, there are proven methods of flashings that have not failed for centurys.

User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 1377
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line AA-220
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice/Buck
Location: Blissfield, MI

Post By: swyman » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 11:55 am

There are many seasoned masons in my area that build chimneys. I just have been afraid to call them for a bid because of the price but maybe I am just being to cheap. It is either pony up or be a slave to this power vent.....as I get older I am not going want to be outside kneeling on rock landscape removing guards and nuts to remove the motor/fan and then drag the air hose to blow out the housing, bring shop vac out to suck out the inside of my vent pipe where the 5" to 8" transition is..... PITA!

User avatar
hotblast1357
Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon. Mar. 10, 2014 10:06 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1984 Eshland S260 coal gun
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh anthracite pea
Other Heating: oil furnace
Location: Peasleeville NY

Post By: hotblast1357 » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 11:58 am

Ya... and it’s on the gable end, even if it did leak, it’s just going down the gable ends, this isn’t a chimney inside the house..

User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 1377
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line AA-220
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice/Buck
Location: Blissfield, MI

Post By: swyman » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 12:08 pm

hotblast1357 wrote:
Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 11:58 am
Ya... and it’s on the gable end, even if it did leak, it’s just going down the gable ends, this isn’t a chimney inside the house..
Might have an new adventure to post about in the off season!

User avatar
McGiever
Member
Posts: 7933
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 5:55 pm

hotblast1357 wrote:
Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 11:58 am
Ya... and it’s on the gable end, even if it did leak, it’s just going down the gable ends, this isn’t a chimney inside the house..

IF it did leak someone needs a fast lesson in proper flashing techniques. It ain't Rocket Science, after all. ;)

User avatar
hotblast1357
Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon. Mar. 10, 2014 10:06 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1984 Eshland S260 coal gun
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh anthracite pea
Other Heating: oil furnace
Location: Peasleeville NY

Post By: hotblast1357 » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 6:18 pm

McGiever wrote:
Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 5:55 pm
IF it did leak someone needs a fast lesson in proper flashing techniques. It ain't Rocket Science, after all. ;)
Absolutely, especially being at the peak, with only 3 sides to flash.

User avatar
McGiever
Member
Posts: 7933
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 6:40 pm

Breaking through down all the way at the eaves would require a "cricket" and "step flashing" on the up hill side.

Image

Visit Alternate Heating Sytems

User avatar
hotblast1357
Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon. Mar. 10, 2014 10:06 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1984 Eshland S260 coal gun
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh anthracite pea
Other Heating: oil furnace
Location: Peasleeville NY

Post By: hotblast1357 » Fri. Jan. 11, 2019 7:33 pm

And I don’t think that’s even necessary with Shane’s because it is in the corner, there will be barely any run off meeting the chimney on the bottom room, if he did something, it would have to be like a half cricket, off the house wall.

lzaharis
Member
Posts: 1603
Joined: Sun. Mar. 25, 2007 8:41 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KAA-4-1 dual fuel boiler
Coal Size/Type: rice/buck mix
Other Heating: kerosene for dual fuel Keystoker/unused
Location: Ithaca, New York

Post By: lzaharis » Sat. Jan. 12, 2019 12:02 am

Installing flashing in a metal roof corner transition mating 2 different roof pitches for a block chimney is an entirely different animal than a shingle roof.

User avatar
McGiever
Member
Posts: 7933
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Sat. Jan. 12, 2019 12:05 am

lzaharis wrote:
Sat. Jan. 12, 2019 12:02 am
Installing flashing in a metal roof corner transition mating 2 different roof pitches for a block chimney is an entirely different animal than a shingle roof.
Different doesn't mean that it can leak when done as required for said conditions...

User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 1377
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Leisure Line AA-220
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice/Buck
Location: Blissfield, MI

Post By: swyman » Sat. Jan. 12, 2019 7:09 am

Steel I can handle, it's the carpenter/masonry stuff that scares me. I am a metalworker/fabricator, I would build everything with steel or aluminum if I had my way.

User avatar
hotblast1357
Member
Posts: 4590
Joined: Mon. Mar. 10, 2014 10:06 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: 1984 Eshland S260 coal gun
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh anthracite pea
Other Heating: oil furnace
Location: Peasleeville NY

Post By: hotblast1357 » Sat. Jan. 12, 2019 8:57 am

Use 8” steel pipe, like well casing, cased inside of like 16” steel pipe, insulated in between.

User avatar
lsayre
Member
Posts: 16651
Joined: Wed. Nov. 23, 2005 9:17 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (13.5 KW), ComfortMax 75
Location: N/E Ohio, between Medina and Wadsworth

Post By: lsayre » Sat. Jan. 12, 2019 9:01 am

Vermiculite beads come to mind here.

lzaharis
Member
Posts: 1603
Joined: Sun. Mar. 25, 2007 8:41 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KAA-4-1 dual fuel boiler
Coal Size/Type: rice/buck mix
Other Heating: kerosene for dual fuel Keystoker/unused
Location: Ithaca, New York

Post By: lzaharis » Sat. Jan. 12, 2019 9:48 am

6 inch screwed together well casing with couplers is almost $40.00 a foot now and 12 inch would be at least 90 dollars a foot if you could not find a pipe supplier that would sell it to you.
You would need to have stays welded in place to hold the outer pipe in place and then insulate around it.
The other issue is simple corrosion which would eat the pipe even with a cap and extension.

Not trying to spend his valuable money; but finding someone that relines chimneys with an inflated packer would save him a lot of work and money as a smaller rectangular or square block chimney could be used and then the inflated packer would be placed in the chimney after the chimney is secured to the wall with the stand off weldments to create a round chimney bore rather than using refractory chimney tile that would be equal to the flue breech size to maintain the proper sized inside diameter flow path for the flue gasses through the chimney in to the basement and adding a concrete chimney cap and stainless steel extension would aid in maintaining the draft and preventing down drafts.




My thoughts anyway.
Last edited by lzaharis on Sat. Jan. 12, 2019 10:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

Visit Alternate Heating Sytems

Post Reply

Return to “Stoker Coal Boilers Using Anthracite (Hydronic & Steam)”