Looking to Install a Boiler

anthony7812 · Post by **anthony7812** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 11:05 am

Well once spring arrives and the big deck project takes place my next big home upgrade is to install a boiler setup. Me and the wife have made the decision to install a coal boiler! Here's my problem WHICH ONE! I don't wanna break the bank so a refurbed unit would be sufficient as long as it's from a reputable restorer. My hot air oil furnace was a thermopride rated at 130000 btu's. Can I use that BTU rating for sizing a boiler? My Harman mark3 is only 90000 and it heats the home but not uniformly and it doesn't produce dhw either so I know I will need a higher than 90 rating. I'm lea in towards an EFM unit and the 520 seems to be the model meant for my home. I have chit chatted with a few folks about models and manufacturers but not an open topic so here it is. Any suggestions?

GoodProphets · Post by **GoodProphets** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 11:46 am

A 520 is up to the task.
You can vary the input/output so it will fit your needs.

I see a lot of refurbers have some for sale here on the forum.
If you are going for the furnace side, I just do not see many used heat exchangers BUT
I am sure there is some though....possibly get a new one?

Post by **Rob R.** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 11:57 am

Do you intend to install a water-to-air heat exchanger in the oil furnace plenum?

Do you have a chimney available?

How much space is available for the boiler?

anthony7812 · Post by **anthony7812** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 12:10 pm

I have 3 flues on the home , 2 in a shared beautiful field stone chimney and then the other is a matched brick chimney where the oil furnace was. I will be removing every single duct from the old furnace. The oil furnace is gone, removed that hog Sunday. I'm looking at installing the boiler in the brick chimney (tile lined) due to location in the basement. Yes I have a lot of work ahead, plumbing and baseboards and all that jazz needs to be installed.

GoodProphets · Post by **GoodProphets** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 12:12 pm

Ohh, you are installing hot water baseboards?

Do you have space for cast iron stand ups?
How about open for in floor radiant?

kstills · Post by **kstills** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 12:20 pm

http://www.builditsolar.com/References/Calculator ... atLoss.htm

Heat loss calculator for figuring out your needs.

Agree with the radiant/radiator ideas, imho better than baseboard for comfort, both are quite a bit more work for installation.

SMITTY · Post by **SMITTY** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 12:22 pm

Yeah it'll definitely be some work, but you will LOVE it when it's done.

Lucky for me, my house already had all that, so all I had to do was tie my stoker into the existing oil boiler.

I think this boiler is the same size (or maybe a touch less ...) as my oil boiler. Before Jim dropped it off, he called and asked me what the plate said on my oil boiler. I told him 113K BTU's ... and he showed up with the one I'm running now. Before I painted it, there was a "110K" painted on the top. Must be what it is ... but only a guess at this point. All I can say is, it works AWESOME - best thing I've ever done for this house ... and my sanity.

Thanks Jim ol' buddy! R.I.P.

anthony7812 · Post by **anthony7812** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 12:34 pm

I'm not interested in radiant flooring heat but not ruling out some stand up radiators. I don't mind the baseboard units in some rooms but the basement using a standup radiator would be great for what I'm thinking using as a dump zone if needed. Not to mention the heat I would want down thier. I'm thinking of tappin the cold line to my electric water heater to go to boiler coil then back to water heater cold side also. 3 ball valves one to boiler one back from boiler and one between so I could go back to electric if I needed. Now expansion tanks, operating pressures and circulation pumps I'm gonna need assistance with.

Sting · Post by **Sting** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 12:48 pm

anthony7812 wrote:Any suggestions?

Can you thread pipe?

anthony7812 · Post by **anthony7812** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 12:50 pm

Let me add my 4 year old daughter already thinks hot water is free so I'm sure the 4 month old will be their before I know. I can't image in my hot water demand come teen years.

GoodProphets · Post by **GoodProphets** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 1:02 pm

You should price out new baseboard (but still think you should shy away)
and also price out used cast iron stand ups...or cast iron bb if you can find it.

If I were to replace all my cast iron with used it would be somewhere in the $5k range or more.
Not sure on your home, but you can find houses where they are being ripped out of.
CL has some and also some re-use/purpose stores and specific cast iron stores.
I have seen generally $100-300 for most cast iron stand ups, but it
will take a lot of planning and figuring to find out what you need.

I also did check pricing on newer style radiators....and ohh boy they are not cheap.
Prices I saw were darn near 800-1000 each....and that would be per room for the most part.

I have been reading a few posts where copper fin bb is just not cutting it.
I have no clue on the cost, so that is why I told you to price it.

A 520 will sure be able to handle the load....
everlasting hot water for showers

do you have a thread on your home or can you say how large is it?

anthony7812 · Post by **anthony7812** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 1:09 pm

Sting wrote:
anthony7812 wrote:Any suggestions?
Can you thread pipe?

I can but I do not have the required tools to do that at home. I've only threaded black pipe maybe 2 or 3 times, not much demand for black pipe as an electrician.

anthony7812 · Post by **anthony7812** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 1:12 pm

I'm not sure why copper fin baseboard wouldn't cut it? Sized properly I don't know why it wouldn't work, first I personally heard of this. Some citing would be nice, I'm far from an expert on hot water space heating.

Post by **Rob R.** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 1:19 pm

Copper fin/tube baseboard is not as expensive as many people think. Last year I think it was $10 per foot at my local supply house. It can be more or less depending on the brand and how many endcaps you need, etc. Speaking of supply house...most of them have a heating guy on staff that will be happy to size the baseboards for you. You need to know room dimensions, window/door sizes, etc. Slant Fin also had a neat program that allowed you to figure that out on your own. I have a copy of it somewhere.

GoodProphets wrote:I have been reading a few posts where copper fin bb is just not cutting it.

If there isn't enough radiation, you will be cold...that holds true for baseboard, convectors, free standing radiators, etc.

Sting · Post by **Sting** » Tue. Dec. 10, 2013 1:28 pm

anthony7812 wrote:
Sting wrote: Can you thread pipe?
I can but I do not have the required tools to do that at home. I've only threaded black pipe maybe 2 or 3 times, not much demand for black pipe as an electrician.

That tells me enough
Do a proper heat loss calculation so you KNOW how much radiation you need in EACH area - then buy and install that proper amount - pumping and piping to and from that [ not to mention correctly sized boiler purchase] comes later - you have heard of the cart in front of the horse?

but first buy the books and teach yourself what you need to know so you can ask the right questions

I am sorry - my responses are limited - you must ask the right questions