Scrapyard Find: EFM AF With S15 Stoker

User avatar
agcowvet
Member
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon. Oct. 08, 2012 9:27 pm
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: efm AF150
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Other Heating: Newmac NL-2 (oil)
Location: Stanley, Finger Lakes, NY

Post Mon. Apr. 08, 2013 4:19 pm

$25 a hundredweight, loaded.

Don't remember serial #, it's at home on back of truck. Corners of cabinet are rounded; 2-tone deep metallic blue with lighter blue front. Some 'body shop' work to do on the covers--got dented at the yard somehow; welding of heat exchanger, new worm tube, worm, and some stuff with the stoker (cleanup, reseal, etc.) are what I see it needs, so far. And I need more penetrating oil. Hasn't been outside very long at all, stoker parts look good, covered with a film of oily dirt, and the ashes are dry.

Pictures to come later.

Questions:

--approx. age?

--Blower only has a 1/3 hp motor, looks a little small for the blower, but I am no expert...too small or OK?

--There looks to be a vertical 'baffle' in the round part of hx above the firepot. The center is melted away. Is this replaceable or is it a welded-in piece?

--Bottom of square part of hx is rotten, any tricky stuff here or just weld on new?

--OR...how much would a new heat exchanger run? Order of magnitude/ballpark figure.

Thanks much
Jacob

Visit Alternate Heating Sytems

User avatar
LsFarm
Member
Posts: 7384
Joined: Sun. Nov. 20, 2005 8:02 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Self-built 'Big Bertha' SS Boiler
Baseburners & Antiques: Keystone 11, Art Garland
Location: Michigan

Post Mon. Apr. 08, 2013 4:25 pm

Hi Jacob, photos will definitely help with answering your questions.

As for the penetrating oil,, use a mix of ATF [automatic transmission fluid] and acetone or Laquer thiner,, a 50/50 mix of ATF and your choice of solvents.. This mix has proven to be much cheaper and much more effective than the commercially available rust penetrants like Kroil, Liquid wrench, PBS Blaster etc. just use a small brush and brush it on the rusted parts..

Looking forward to a whole bunch of photos. :lol:

Greg L

User avatar
whistlenut
Member
Posts: 3548
Joined: Sat. Mar. 17, 2007 6:29 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AA130's,260's, AHS130&260's,EFM900,GJ & V-Wert
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Franks,Itasca 415,Jensen, NYer 130,Van Wert
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Alaska, EFM, Keystoker, Yellow Flame
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Alaska, Keystoker-2,Leisure Line
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Alaska, Gibraltar, Keystone,Vc Vigilant 2
Hand Fed Coal Furnace: Ford, Jensen, NYer, Van Wert,
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwoods
Coal Size/Type: Barley, Buck, Rice ,Nut, Stove
Other Heating: Oil HWBB
Location: Central NH, Concord area

Post Mon. Apr. 08, 2013 9:12 pm

....and NO SMOKING if you use Greg's rust solvent!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea:

User avatar
Rick 386
Member
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon. Jan. 28, 2008 4:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AA 260 heating both sides of twin farmhouse
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL Hyfire II w/ coaltrol in garage
Coal Size/Type: Pea in AA 260, Rice in LL Hyfire II
Other Heating: Gas fired infared at work
Location: Royersford, Pa
Contact:

Post Mon. Apr. 08, 2013 9:59 pm

I always preferred the acetone over lacquer thinner.

The high is much better, more better, really nice, oh look at the pretty flowers.................................

Make sure you have adequate ventilation if you use either to cut the ATF.

Rick

User avatar
agcowvet
Member
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon. Oct. 08, 2012 9:27 pm
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: efm AF150
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Other Heating: Newmac NL-2 (oil)
Location: Stanley, Finger Lakes, NY

Post Mon. Apr. 08, 2013 10:04 pm

As long as air and fuel are in proper mix there should be no smoke right? :lol:

What kind of container do you put this stuff in? Does it eat plastic? I'm thinking maybe one of the old-school all-metal oil cans with a long spout, the kind you push on the bottom to make the stuff come out...if I can find one easy. Something repurposed would be even better, I'm cheap. No, make that 'resource conscious'.

Are projects like this best kept here, or put into the e-f-m heating forum?

Pictures below. Is it usual custom here to keep them below to make it easier on dialup folks, or to put them inline for better reading?

As you can see, it was run for some time with no air filters, plenty of dust everywhere on the blower. The bottom of the secondary heat exchanger section is pretty rotten, especially in the rear. My guess is, sat for too long in a damp basement over the summer, with ashes still in. You can see it has been 'patched' with a section of metal sign.

The top of the secondary section also has one corner that has a separated weld. Looks easy enough to fix.

Burn pot looks OK, though some of the machine screw heads seem a little melted, and their nuts have come loose. The baffle is quite badly eaten. What makes that happen--running too high a fire, excess air, or something else?

Also, the same image, you can see there is a section of the sidewall of the primary heat exchanger (worm side) that is getting very thin. Almost looks like the head of the bolt there has been melted also.

Thanks much for any input. Also, I am a pretty novice welder, haven't really done any in about ten years or so, and back then it was almost all stick, and set up the way the guy helping me told me to do it. What would be the best way and the most economical way (2 or more answers is fine!) to repair this sort of trouble? Flux-core wire, MIG, TIG (I see some 'inverter' welders that aren't too much!), or really thin electrode with low juice stick?
Attachments
Front and stoker side.jpg
Front and stoker side
Stoker side.jpg
Stoker side
Worm side.jpg
Worm side
Burn pot and baffle.jpg
Burn pot and baffle
Baffle eaten.jpg
Primary hx baffle eaten
Burn pot and ash pit.jpg
Burn pot and ash pit
Blower info stamps.jpg
Blower stamps
Blower motor.jpg
Blower motor
Bottom of secondary hx.jpg
Rotten secondary
Separated by weld top of secondary hx.jpg
Separated by weld top of secondary

User avatar
agcowvet
Member
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon. Oct. 08, 2012 9:27 pm
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: efm AF150
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Other Heating: Newmac NL-2 (oil)
Location: Stanley, Finger Lakes, NY

Post Mon. Apr. 08, 2013 10:07 pm

I have another, better picture of the rotten secondary. Ran out of space in the above post.
Attachments
Bottom of rear chamber secondary hx.jpg

User avatar
agcowvet
Member
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon. Oct. 08, 2012 9:27 pm
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: efm AF150
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Other Heating: Newmac NL-2 (oil)
Location: Stanley, Finger Lakes, NY

Post Mon. Apr. 08, 2013 10:11 pm

Does e-f-m make parts and service information available online for these, or go to local dealer and see if can order paper manuals?

Also, any problem using your penetrating fluid mixes followed by a torch, as long as a day or two have passed in between? Guessing not, as those solvents are so volatile, but...I try to heed the voice of experience and avoid singed eyebrows, when possible.

User avatar
Berlin
Site Moderator
Posts: 1847
Joined: Thu. Feb. 09, 2006 1:25 pm
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Will-Burt Combustioneer 77B
Coal Size/Type: Ohio BITUMINOUS pea stoker coal
Location: Buffalo/Adirondacks, NY

Post Tue. Apr. 09, 2013 12:58 am

I like to use penetrating fluids with a torch and a hammer... but this will cause fire so be careful or you could burn and die.

Visit Alternate Heating Sytems

User avatar
Freddy
Member
Posts: 6622
Joined: Fri. Apr. 11, 2008 2:54 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 130 (pea)
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Reading piece o' junk in the barn (rice)
Coal Size/Type: Pea size, Superior, deep mined
Location: Orrington, Maine

Post Tue. Apr. 09, 2013 3:36 am

Looks like quite a project!

Kroil? The secret is out! I was keeping that to myself. Well, seeing as Greg spilled his guts, I'll say: I've tried them all and, for me, Kroil penetrates like no other. If you want to try it call Kano laboratories at 800-311-3374. Tell them "I have a friend that got two giant spray cans ... they looked over 16 oz...for about $18 and that included delivery? Can I get that price and try some out?" Other than that you'll pay over $16 per can plus delivery! They have given me a super deal twice now.

Best of luck on the project.

coalnewbie
Member
Posts: 6240
Joined: Sat. May. 24, 2008 4:26 pm
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Invader 2
Baseburners & Antiques: Wings Best, Glenwood #8(x2) Herald 116x
Coal Size/Type: Rice,
Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22
Location: Chester, NY

Post Tue. Apr. 09, 2013 4:36 am

Kroil? The secret is out! I was keeping that to myself.
Four years on this board and STILL learning every day.

User avatar
stovepipemike
Member
Posts: 1200
Joined: Sun. Jun. 15, 2008 11:53 am
Stove/Furnace Make: Keystoker
Stove/Furnace Model: KAA-2
Location: Morgantown ,Penna

Post Tue. Apr. 09, 2013 8:15 am

It is good to hear that someone besides me haunts the scrap yards looking for good ol' American Industrial Art to save from deportation . I cannot figure out why it is but it is a fact that one can get the older steel items apart easier than the modern stuff.I am thinking that they used better blends of steel in the past.For me,the acetylene torch gets it done after I have tried all of the canned goods and impact devices. Just like a doctor believes,do the least harm first.Go easy,go safe. Please keep us informed about your restoration. Mike

Pacowy
Member
Posts: 2809
Joined: Tue. Sep. 04, 2007 10:14 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: H.B. Smith 350 Mills boiler/EFM 85R stoker
Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/anthracite
Location: Dalton, MA

Post Tue. Apr. 09, 2013 8:26 am

stovepipemike wrote: I cannot figure out why it is but it is a fact that one can get the older steel items apart easier than the modern stuff.I am thinking that they used better blends of steel in the past.
x2. I like the older units for that reason.

Mike

User avatar
LsFarm
Member
Posts: 7384
Joined: Sun. Nov. 20, 2005 8:02 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Self-built 'Big Bertha' SS Boiler
Baseburners & Antiques: Keystone 11, Art Garland
Location: Michigan

Post Tue. Apr. 09, 2013 8:32 am

I use Kroil for cleaning firearms, it removes copper and powder fouling from the bore quite well. :D It's too expensive to use in quantity on old cars or boilers.

In the old car restoration business several different studies have been done and the results are that whie all the commercial penetrants do work, the best is the ATF/solvent mix, and it's better by a wide margin. The studies use rusted fasteners in a controlled study, and use the 'break-awy torque needed after an application of different penetrants after various times of soaking.. Neat studies, and the stuff does work..

All the commercial penetrants are kerosene with a perfume added. Kerosene is close to Diesel and Jet A,, and ATF is just a very thin hydralic oil, around 0wt .
The solvent tends to do the creeping into the tight, rusted crevases, but it brings along the disolved ATF, then the solvent evaporates, leaving the ATF as a lubricant.

ALL commercial penetrants are flamable, and caution should be used. Kerosene burns very well, regardless of the can it comes from.. I used to use WD-40 as a starting fluid in my chainsaw.. works great.. IE: very flamable.

Like Berlin, I've found best results from using heat, a torch of some kind, then cool the rusted joint with ATF or even regular motor oil, it fumes and will ignite if there is open flame.. and it stinks.. but the oil is drawn in by the cooling of the rusted joint, and eventually the parts break free.

I mix the stuff in a 1-gallon solvent can.. I had a half gallon of acetone remaining in a 1 gallon can, I added 2 quarts of ATF, and it's lasted a long time.. I have used the old style 'finger pump' oil can to dispense it, but you can use a plastic pump bottle like from '409' or the many cleaning products.. the spray mechanism eventually fails. but you were going to thorw the spray bottle away anyway? right?

Anybody workng unde a car with lots of penetrant gets a snoot-full of fragrance and atomized solvents.. well I get a headache, not a pleasant 'high' :mad:

Good luck with your rebuild project,, looks like a good find, and it'll keep you home at night for a while. :lol:

Greg L

User avatar
Sting
Member
Posts: 2966
Joined: Mon. Feb. 25, 2008 4:24 pm
Other Heating: OBSO Lennox Pulse "Air Scorcher" burning NG
Location: Lower Fox Valley = Wisconsin

Post Tue. Apr. 09, 2013 8:51 am

I am black iron threaded pipe sort of guy

opps --- wrong thread

I have a propensity to M.E.K.

Yes Senator - I am an alcoholic - its been 6 or 7 minutes since my last beer

User avatar
LsFarm
Member
Posts: 7384
Joined: Sun. Nov. 20, 2005 8:02 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Self-built 'Big Bertha' SS Boiler
Baseburners & Antiques: Keystone 11, Art Garland
Location: Michigan

Post Tue. Apr. 09, 2013 9:42 am

Rick 386 wrote:I always preferred the acetone over lacquer thinner.

The high is much better, more better, really nice, oh look at the pretty flowers.................................

Make sure you have adequate ventilation if you use either to cut the ATF.

Rick
Did you say use ether to cut the ATF!! Now that would be a buzz,, and a bump on the head when you hit the floor ! :shock: :lol:

Greg L

Visit Alternate Heating Sytems

Post Reply

Return to “Stoker Coal Boilers Using Anthracite (Hydronic & Steam)”