Large Hot Water System Efficiency

waldo lemieux
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Posts: 2266
Joined: Sun. Sep. 30, 2012 8:20 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: efm
Stove/Furnace Model: s-20
Location: Ithaca,NY

Post Mon. Jan. 07, 2013 6:28 pm

oops :oops: I guess that had already been suggested

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Short Bus
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Posts: 510
Joined: Sun. Jan. 10, 2010 12:22 am
Stoker Coal Boiler: Kewanee boiler with Anchor stoker
Coal Size/Type: Chestnut / Sub-bituminous C
Other Heating: Propane wall furnace back up only
Location: Cantwell Alaska

Post Mon. Jan. 07, 2013 6:52 pm

Efficiency,
Coal burns, heat is transmitted to the water in the system.
All heat in the water ends up in the house, unless you run the pipes outside, to or from a shop or somthing.
So you have three things to work on.

1. Combustion efficiency
2. Heat tranfer into the water.
3. Heat loss from house to ouside.

Combustion efficiency, correct air evenly applied to the coal bed, and no extra air being sucked though the boiler by the chiminy. If your chiminy is centrally located it will radiate heat into the house also, but extra air thought the boiler is bad.
Heat transfer to the water, clean the heat exchanging surfaces of your boiler, once a month for me.
Heat loss from house, probalby about a million ideas about how to fix that, and every home has this issue.

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franpipeman
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Posts: 209
Joined: Fri. Jan. 11, 2008 4:27 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: efm 520 stoker fitzgibbons pressure vessel
Hand Fed Coal Stove: harman, russo
Coal Size/Type: rice
Other Heating: alpine propane condensing boiler radiant floor
Location: Wernersville pa

Post Mon. Jan. 07, 2013 7:09 pm

http://www.hvaccalc.com/main.asp
49$ used it for ac and heating three houses. I was trained the old way in the mid 70s which was tedious this does Fine $50.00 is nothing

heat loss program for a limited time and 49$ you can do all the calc you like and its user friend shows duct size and maybe pipe size

CoalBurner5
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Posts: 114
Joined: Mon. Nov. 08, 2010 9:20 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 520 Dual Fuel

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 3:55 pm

Okay so set me straight on a few questions.

1.) can someone please explain exactly how to check for draft? (YES PLEASE GIVE ME EVERYTHING, fan on if so for how long.)
2.) I take a reading at the door through the hole and I want it to be .02 is that correct?
3.) also the second reading I want that to be between my barometric damper and the flue collar on the boiler correct?

Again please give me step by step because I KNOW I NEED IT.

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Rob R.
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Posts: 11507
Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy
Location: Chazy, NY

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 4:40 pm

CoalBurner5 wrote:Okay so set me straight on a few questions.

1.) can someone please explain exactly how to check for draft? (YES PLEASE GIVE ME EVERYTHING, fan on if so for how long.)
2.) I take a reading at the door through the hole and I want it to be .02 is that correct? Yes.
3.) also the second reading I want that to be between my barometric damper and the flue collar on the boiler correct? Yes, about 12" from the flue collar if possible. Look for -0.04 to -0.05"
Generally speaking, the boiler should be at operating temperature and you should let the stoker run (burn) for 20-30 minutes before you use the draft reading to adjust the barometric damper. As a baseline, I would set the baro weight at #5. Note that the weight goes on the left side if the damper is on a horizontal piece of pipe...right side if vertical.

Before you adjust anything I suggest that you make sure the boiler, stoker burn plates, flue pipe, and chimney are clean. It is supposed to be mild weather for the next couple days, so this is a good time to shut down the unit and do a proper cleaning. It is also a good time to check that the feed/air ratio is correct.

5 teeth and 4.5 air is a pretty decent starting point for rice coal. Once the boiler is up to temperature and has been running for a few hours, put a load on it and make the stoker run for 30 minutes...at that point you should have about 1-2" of ash around the fire. If you have slightly more ash, reduce the air to 4.25...if the burning coal is creeping onto the burner ring around the plates, increase the air to 4.75 or so. Repeat the "test burn" and tweak as necessary until you are satisfied that the fire appearance is correct...double check the draft after the fire is tuned.

CoalBurner5
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Posts: 114
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Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 520 Dual Fuel

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 4:52 pm

Alright I've checked my draft and just like everyone says the draw is .02 at fire box door. I drilled a hole on the "T" at the collar. and the draw there is also .02. how is that possible?

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Rob R.
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Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy
Location: Chazy, NY

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 5:37 pm

Pull the tubing off your draft gauge and blow through it...it could be obstructed.

CoalBurner5
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Posts: 114
Joined: Mon. Nov. 08, 2010 9:20 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 520 Dual Fuel

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 5:48 pm

Already checked for obstruction.

.02 at door and at collar.

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Rob R.
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Posts: 11507
Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy
Location: Chazy, NY

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 5:57 pm

Is that with the stoker running?

CoalBurner5
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Posts: 114
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Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 520 Dual Fuel

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 6:04 pm

Fire was running for 30 mins. Then I shut down the system and immediately took readings. .02 at both locations.

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Rob R.
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Posts: 11507
Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy
Location: Chazy, NY

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 6:06 pm

Take the reading with the stoker running.

CoalBurner5
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Posts: 114
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Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 520 Dual Fuel

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 6:12 pm

Ok and put air at 0?

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Rob R.
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Posts: 11507
Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy
Location: Chazy, NY

Post Tue. Jan. 08, 2013 6:18 pm

No, set the air where EFM recommends for the feed rate. 4 clicks & 4 air, or 5 clicks & 4.5 air. I would run 5 clicks and 4.5 air for now.

CoalBurner5
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Posts: 114
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Stove/Furnace Make: EFM 520 Dual Fuel

Post Wed. Jan. 09, 2013 2:37 pm

Okay so I bumped up the feed to 5 air is set at 4.5. I have a good fire going. I killed the power and took a reading. I got the same reading at both the door and collar.

So about the only thing I can think of is bump my coal up to maybe 6 and push the air to efm standards and hope that more coal will hold a stronger fire and use less coal.

Any other thoughts?

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Rob R.
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Posts: 11507
Joined: Fri. Dec. 28, 2007 4:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: EFM DF520
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: Dad's 1953 EFM Highboy
Location: Chazy, NY

Post Wed. Jan. 09, 2013 2:43 pm

Why do you keep shutting it off before you take the reading?! The stoker must be running when you check the draft reading at the door, and at the flue pipe.

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