VanWert 600 Won’t Shut Off

Pacowy · Post by **Pacowy** » Mon. Jul. 15, 2019 7:40 am

Some people have (loss of) draft issues in warm weather that can contribute to outfires, and things like dropping the low limit setting and skimping on timer cycles can contribute to that. The boiler needs to be kept hot enough to maintain draft, and that may require burning more coal than you think of as being needed to carry the actual load.

Mike

prplhz96 · Post by **prplhz96** » Wed. Jul. 17, 2019 8:09 am

Well, I gave up with my combustion analyzer. The reading are to inconsistent to get a good baseline. I’m going to swap out the triple aquastat today, this bastard has been going out consistently since these issues arose. Makes 0 sense, because the stoker ran damn beautiful until the timer issue. I haven’t had an outfire in prolly 16 months till now.
It’s too had to adjust the aquastat with it being so far off compared to the actual boiler temp (I am verifying boiler temp by actual water temp and using my no contact therm on the dhw coil plate).
So, I want to start from scratch. What is a good baseline to start with the air intake? It has been at 3.5 as long as I’m in the house and has never been adjusted. At this point I have tried lowering and raising the air shutter, but stoker is still going out. I have a good 40 degrees between my low and high limit, so I know the timer is working and firing when it should.

lzaharis · Post by **lzaharis** » Wed. Jul. 17, 2019 9:02 am

I was having trouble with my stoker operating in warmer periods until I found out the flue breech was plugged perhaps you have a mountain of ash in the flue breech like I did.

I also added more pins to create four burn times every thirty minutes on my hold fire timer as any less time caused out fires.

Based solely on my past experience and the 64 owners of keystokers that had defective hydrolevel 3250 plus units do not purchase a digital triple aquastat.

I kicked both of the bad hydrolevel units to the curb and purchased 2 Honeywell L8124L1011 horizontal triple aquastats(one is a spare) and a B+G RB-122-E low water cut off as both of the digital units failed.

I sleep very well in the heating season now with the mechanical triple aquastat and the RB-122-E Low water cut off riding herd on my kaa-4-1 no thanks to keystoker.

The RB-122-E Low Water cut off can be installed in several locations in the piping and in the steam chest if you have an unused tapping. The RB-122-E is a conductive low water cut off that is directly immersed in the water.

The Honeywell mechanical triple aquastats are still available; I purchased mine from Patriot Supply.
I purchased my B+G low water cut off from Tribro supply in Vestal, New York.

Check your flue breech pipe first as you may not need a new triple aquastat.

McGiever · Post by **McGiever** » Wed. Jul. 17, 2019 9:32 am

Many overlook the fact that the non-contact infrared thermometers are inaccurate when being used on different color surfaces.
The more reflective the surface the more inaccurate the results...flat black is best...white or shiny silver and even copper do poorly.

A sprayed dot of black rattle-can paint or a piece of black tape can be a better "target"...

prplhz96 · Post by **prplhz96** » Thu. Jul. 18, 2019 8:57 pm

Well, hopefully this is my last reply to this thread. Think I finally got the old bitch figured out. I’ll write the “cliff notes” version of my stupidity and the good ol’ kiss method of problem solving that I completely overlooked.
-boiler goes out for numerous days in a row
-clean boiler, smoke pipe, and chimney
-replace triple aquastat
-check draft
-fine tune baro dampener
-fine tune air shutter
-shut off the fu*king box fan my wife has turned on, which is on the other side of the basement, blowing out of the casement window

Voila, problem solved. God damn fan was pulling air back thru the baro and boiler couldn’t draft

So, how was my draft reading perfect and how was I able to adjust the air shutter and baro dampener you ask? Well, I’ll tell ya. When I worked on this unit since Saturday night, it has been in the evening. 6pm-11pm or so every night of trying everything. Our basement is muggy, hence the fan my wife put over at the other window creating a nice cross breeze down there. Well, the fan was sucking more than the other window could let in, so it was pulling from the chimney. All of my tests were perfect because (muggy basement don’t forget), I had the garage door open everynight I was messing with it. So every night, when I came upstairs the stoker was running perfect. What I didn’t realize was that as soon as I came upstairs and closed the garage door down there, I created the issue all over again. So every morning I went down and the stoker was out, first thing was open the garage door for some fresh air and relight, close the garage door and go to work, get a call 2 hours later that it’s out again. That was all week. Ugh. What a dumbass I am. What an oversight on my part.
Well, that’s it for me, I’ll goin to go and have a beer after this damn fiasco. Thanks fellas

Post by **Rob R.** » Thu. Jul. 18, 2019 9:07 pm

Glad you got it figured out.

Turn the box fan around.

Post by **CoalJockey** » Thu. Jul. 18, 2019 9:12 pm

We are glad you got it nailed down. That’s a hell of a lot of small things adding up to the perfect storm there that you created.

Don’t feel bad, sometimes it’s all too easy to overlook those little things. I have relit stokers due to my own madness more than I would like to admit through the years.

CapeCoaler · Post by **CapeCoaler** » Fri. Jul. 19, 2019 6:45 am

Nicely done...
Kiss is my motto...
Sometimes not always followed...
I tell people when they say 'yay it is fixed'...
'Not until I figure out how it broke in the first place...
LOL...

prplhz96 · Post by **prplhz96** » Fri. Jul. 19, 2019 9:19 am

First morning since Saturday the stoker is still lit. Sweet! Thanks again fellas

Pacowy · Post by **Pacowy** » Fri. Jul. 19, 2019 11:02 am

Nice work figuring that out. When we ran stoker for DHW in summer it was a very effective dehumidifier. You might want to consider leaving that window just cracked open a little, so the flow of makeup air limits moisture buildup without needing a fan.

Mike

prplhz96 · Post by **prplhz96** » Sat. Jul. 20, 2019 4:15 pm

Pacowy wrote: ↑
Fri. Jul. 19, 2019 11:02 am
Nice work figuring that out. When we ran stoker for DHW in summer it was a very effective dehumidifier. You might want to consider leaving that window just cracked open a little, so the flow of makeup air limits moisture buildup without needing a fan.

Mike

We leave both windows open all summer, but the humidity down there is crazy. We actually fight high humidity all thru the year in this house. One day I will measure the floor in the basement for moisture. I believe that no vapor barrier was ever installed before they poured as crazy as that sounds. House is only 26 years old and insulated very very well, it’s the only thing I can think of that would cause high humidity from the cellar right on up

Dave 1234 · Post by **Dave 1234** » Sun. Jul. 21, 2019 10:37 am

I burn all year too.

If you can find a 8'' aluminium ''to go container'' use it streched over the baro and fold it down tight to seal the opening.

It works good, no out-fires, and no timer. My boiler is set-up with an EFM S-20 stoker.

I do turn up the air a bit, but it gives me hot water all summer for one grain scoop of coal per day.

Dave

Post by **Rob R.** » Sun. Jul. 21, 2019 10:44 am

Dave - I used to cover the baro in warm weather also, but on windy days it would burn up all of the coal in the pot. Probably not an issue if the wind doesn't impact your chimney much, but it was a problem for me.

Dave 1234 · Post by **Dave 1234** » Sun. Jul. 21, 2019 5:14 pm

Rob R. wrote: ↑
Sun. Jul. 21, 2019 10:44 am
Dave - I used to cover the baro in warm weather also, but on windy days it would burn up all of the coal in the pot. Probably not an issue if the wind doesn't impact your chimney much, but it was a problem for me.

I can see that happening Rob. I keep 2 draft meters in the stack, here they mostly sit around neg .03-.04 , but like you wrote, every set-up is unique .

Dave