Moving PEA size coal by Vacuum

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McGiever
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Posts: 6820
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Converted Riteway into a Stoker Fed
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Harman Magnum
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Baseburners & Antiques: Our Glenwood 111 ; Art Garland 130 ; Favorite 513
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Thu. Apr. 05, 2018 9:34 am

My prototype barrel is pictured on page 1 , 3rd post. (Note: I have since abandoned that shown blower/collector)
It's a poly 55 gallon drum I had once used for a AA auger bin and I have now repurposed for my experiments.
I crudely patched the old unneeded auger hole and cut a plywood (OSB) top lid and sealed that plywood very well to have no leaks basicly. Bucket is not used anylonger and could be eliminated also.

The poly barrel is quite strong for holding it's shape under vacuum and I feel it could still remain strong even being shortened for fitting over top of a bin...of course the lid would need resized and resealed after shortening.

I chose a friction lid seal and used a length of garage door rubber seal which I wedged all around and hammered the plywood lid down tight with a rubber mallet...very effective and allows for removal since this is a prototype and change is a certainty.

My next version will incorporate a 3" poly cyclone between the drum and the vacuum to drop out any dust ahead of entering the vac filter/bag for contintinued peak vac performance rather than diminishing performance and extra maintenance with allowing dust to enter vac.

Poly drums can be found on Craig'sList for cheap. And 75mm cyclone can be had on ebay and ships from China.

HTH

Qtown1835
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Posts: 434
Joined: Sat. Nov. 08, 2014 11:47 am
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker '81 KA4 (online 1/16/17)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: EFM SPK600
Location: Quakertown, PA

Post By: Qtown1835 » Thu. Apr. 05, 2018 12:03 pm

Cool. Im using a 15gal poly drum and it collapses under vacuum if there is a blockage. Once it happens the first time it usually happens easier each subsequent time. I tried a dust deputy prior to the vac and it killed the suction too much, a 3" should be more effective. I think im going to build a new wood vacuum chamber or try to find a similar size steel drum that is ribbed.

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McGiever
Member
Posts: 6820
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Converted Riteway into a Stoker Fed
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Harman Magnum
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Baseburners & Antiques: Our Glenwood 111 ; Art Garland 130 ; Favorite 513
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Thu. Apr. 05, 2018 1:39 pm

Qtown1835 wrote:
Thu. Apr. 05, 2018 12:03 pm
Cool. Im using a 15gal poly drum and it collapses under vacuum if there is a blockage. Once it happens the first time it usually happens easier each subsequent time. I tried a dust deputy prior to the vac and it killed the suction too much, a 3" should be more effective. I think im going to build a new wood vacuum chamber or try to find a similar size steel drum that is ribbed.
Yeah, whatever works.
If your drum is open top you could cut a very narrow plywood doughnut to act as a internal hoop(s) for internal support.
My current 55 gallon poly drum (white) is like 3/8" thick walls and very sturdy as for vacuum pressures. And poly is easily cut to any height needed.

Is your pick up tube cut at a 45*some angle? Might not be so quick to get blocked at the end. :?:

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Qtown1835
Member
Posts: 434
Joined: Sat. Nov. 08, 2014 11:47 am
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker '81 KA4 (online 1/16/17)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: EFM SPK600
Location: Quakertown, PA

Post By: Qtown1835 » Thu. Apr. 05, 2018 7:44 pm

Yeah more than 45* probably like 60* on the pick up. Never had issues with blockages idk if I need more bypass air or if it's a matter of loss of suction. I know that I transferred 2 buckets from bin to Hopper and I'm not doing that all next winter... I'm gonna run with the outdoor dust collector for my suction and get a sturdier barrel. I want to be able to suck the black from the coal

This is the inside of the barrel looking up from the bottom thru the 4" flange
20171021_142024.jpg

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McGiever
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Posts: 6820
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Converted Riteway into a Stoker Fed
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Harman Magnum
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Baseburners & Antiques: Our Glenwood 111 ; Art Garland 130 ; Favorite 513
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Sun. Apr. 15, 2018 10:09 pm

As far as losing suction trying to go thru a inline vortex separator (dust deputy type) you can make the drum/barrel do the vortex w/o the suction losses.

See first two pictures: Inside 2 - 90's both are face counter-clockwise, or could be even cw, doesn't matter which, just so they're matched the same direction.

I try to cut all the suction losses possible to obtain most of what's available from the start.

You may note that after the 2" hose/pipe brings up the PEA size coal and dumps it into the drum thru a 2" - sweep wye 90 and a sweep regular 90 in the drum. Then I used a over sized 4" 90 inside and outside of the drum to then be reduced to a corrugated 2-1/4" shop vac hose into a 6hp shop vac.
If I find a way, I may even try to bump up the size of the corrugated 2-1/4" shop vac hose up to a 3" smooth hose...losses are robbing performance and this size coal is not forgiving at all. :)

The large viewing hole (used to be a 5 gallon bucket w/o a bottom in there) in the center of the wood top was from previous tests and I have moved on from using it. It has however been kind of convenient for reaching in and doing some of the alterations lately w/o having to pop the wood lid back off. I did have to plug/seal that hole before the latest rounds of tests though. Used the old cut-out wood piece and some more of that rubber garage door bottom seal I had used to seal the big wood circle to the cut open drum top.

Hoping I don't need to go back and change many more parts and can continue to move forward to completion.

*Latest tests: Was able to lift/raise up to 8' in height...and travel thru a 12' length of 2" hose. Even with both these obstacles it still had a good flow rate loading PEA into the drum. 8-)

*Up Next: Assemble and Prove a "Hands Free Pick Up Wand" :yes:
I have the plan in my head and the pieces and parts on the bench now. Stay Tuned.
IMG_2407.JPG
2" pick up or inlet side
IMG_2408.JPG
4" discharge or vac side
IMG_2412.JPG
Latest configuration
Note wood seals in drum
IMG_2409.JPG
Today's 2" parts
missing 3 pvc - 2" nipples
IMG_2410.JPG
Today's 4" parts
missing 2nd 90 & duct tape

CapeCoaler
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Posts: 4632
Joined: Sun. Feb. 10, 2008 3:48 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: want AA130
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine BS#4, Harman MKII, Hitzer 503,...
Coal Size/Type: Pea/Nut/Stove
Location: Cape Cod, MA

Post By: CapeCoaler » Mon. Apr. 16, 2018 10:45 am


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McGiever
Member
Posts: 6820
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Converted Riteway into a Stoker Fed
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Harman Magnum
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Baseburners & Antiques: Our Glenwood 111 ; Art Garland 130 ; Favorite 513
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Mon. Apr. 16, 2018 11:13 am

I have some really good smooth 4" here already, plus the required fittings.
Might as well make that adaptation.

Qtown1835
Member
Posts: 434
Joined: Sat. Nov. 08, 2014 11:47 am
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker '81 KA4 (online 1/16/17)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Rice
Other Heating: EFM SPK600
Location: Quakertown, PA

Post By: Qtown1835 » Fri. Jun. 29, 2018 2:27 pm

Any update on this? Curious to see how its working out

User avatar
McGiever
Member
Posts: 6820
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Converted Riteway into a Stoker Fed
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Harman Magnum
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Baseburners & Antiques: Our Glenwood 111 ; Art Garland 130 ; Favorite 513
Coal Size/Type: RICE,PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE and EGG / BIT
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post By: McGiever » Sat. Jun. 30, 2018 12:49 am

No progress, back burner for now.

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