PA off peak electric rates by supplier

 
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BigBarney
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Post by BigBarney » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 2:20 pm

PA has off peak rates for customers... Check your power supplier...

https://www.google.com/search?q=Pennsylvania+off- ... vs=1#tts=0

https://www.firstenergycorp.com/help/pa-time-of-u ... icing.html

Pick where you get your supply and change over if feasable...

BigBarney


 
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Post by BigBarney » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 2:45 pm

Even coal at $260 is more expensive than off peak electric...

Screenshot 2023-09-21 14.29.37.png

Used geothermal and replaced 250% to 300% as efficiency... Coal at $260...

Coal is 220% more expensive..

BigBarney

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Sunny Boy
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Post by Sunny Boy » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 3:46 pm

BigBarney wrote:
Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 2:45 pm
Even coal at $260 is more expensive than off peak electric...

Screenshot 2023-09-21 14.29.37.png

Used geothermal and replaced 250% to 300% as efficiency... Coal at $260...

Coal is 220% more expensive..

BigBarney
The only off-peak rates shown in your links are all over 5 cents a KWH. I've not heard of any lower. At the posted off-peak rates coal at $260 a ton is still cheaper.

And I'm not sure how you get 300% efficiency for geothermal. The geothermal plants don't claim even one tenth of that.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs ... 0513001120

Paul

 
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Post by davidmcbeth3 » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 5:16 pm

Sunny Boy wrote:
Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 3:46 pm
The only off-peak rates shown in your links are all over 5 cents a KWH. I've not heard of any lower. At the posted off-peak rates coal at $260 a ton is still cheaper.

And I'm not sure how you get 300% efficiency for geothermal. The geothermal plants don't claim even one tenth of that.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs ... 0513001120

Paul
Perhaps you put into the geothermal system 100 BTUs and it outputs 300 BTUs .

You essentially drill a hole down to where its hot, put piping to go down and back and your energy spent is on recycling the antifreeze down and back up with the antifreeze absorbing all that "free" heat. So its not 300% efficient per se but you get the "free" heat from mamma Earth.

So while not actually 300% efficient, from the human's perspective it appears as such. Like magic.

 
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Post by Sunny Boy » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 6:50 pm

Is that 300% efficiency geothermal electric power used to run perpetual motion machines ? :baby:

Paul

 
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Post by nut » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 7:03 pm

PPL's off peak rate is still higher than if I shop the market.

 
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Post by Rob R. » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 7:51 pm

The 300% efficiency is based on how many BTUs are produced by resistance electric heat.

E.G. same heat as resistance electric with one third the power.


 
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Post by gaw » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 8:43 pm

Rob R. wrote:
Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 7:51 pm
The 300% efficiency is based on how many BTUs are produced by resistance electric heat.

E.G. same heat as resistance electric with one third the power.
In other words it was created by the marketing department.

 
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Post by Rob R. » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 8:48 pm

The problem with geo thermal is the systems often don’t produce water hot enough to utilize the existing radiation in many homes.

 
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Post by BigBarney » Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 10:31 pm

I used the geothermal line because it allows for a heat pump ....

Heat pumps for residential do not make heat by burning a fuel but by

moving heat from one place to another.. Like your refrigerator moves

the heat from the interior to outside of the box... This can be maximized

by multiplier of 100% to ~800% so if you input 1Kw of energy you get a

correponding multiple back ...

With an air to water heat pump you are able to transfer enough energy

to the water in the off peak hours to sustain your heat through the peak

times, kinda like how a caveman put rocks in the sun during the day to

collect the heat so he didn't have freeze at night.

I used 300% because that is an easily achieveable % with minimal tech-

nology,available now in dhw heat pumps.

The 6 cent in my off peak rate is all in with all taxes and delivery...

The price varies from month to month depending on fuel cost and

the availability to buy cheaper energy....

https://afdc.energy.gov/fuels/properties?fuels=GS ... gher_value

BigBarney

 
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Post by nut » Fri. Sep. 22, 2023 8:30 am

BigBarney wrote:
Thu. Sep. 21, 2023 10:31 pm




The 6 cent in my off peak rate is all in with all taxes and delivery...

The price varies from month to month depending on fuel cost and

the availability to buy cheaper energy....

https://afdc.energy.gov/fuels/properties?fuels=GS ... gher_value

BigBarney
PPL's off peak price was 11+ cents and 15+ cents on peak.
And that is only for supplier costs, not transmission. How is yours so cheap?https://www.pplelectric.com/site/Ways-to-Save/Rat ... f-Use-Plan

 
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Post by Sunny Boy » Fri. Sep. 22, 2023 9:54 am

"geothermal" in the calculator is for geothermal produced electricity, not home heat. That is why I posted the link to geothermal produced electricity.

What's the kwh rate for that type of electric production ?

And how efficient is a heat pump system when it's near below zero for a couple of months?

Paul

 
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Post by nut » Fri. Sep. 22, 2023 10:20 am

Shouldn't change much. The earth temps down that far are constant.

 
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Post by Sunny Boy » Fri. Sep. 22, 2023 11:39 am

nut wrote:
Fri. Sep. 22, 2023 10:20 am
Shouldn't change much. The earth temps down that far are constant.
I understand about constant temps below the frost line. My question is, can it supply enough BTU's ? I've heard complaints that some heat pump systems need other forms of heat with our winters here in the North. How good are heat pump systems even further north ?

Plus, looking at installation costs, they seem to be a rather expensive way to save money. If they are so super-efficient, why don't we see more of them being installed in colder climates like around here ? :roll:

Paul

 
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Post by Rob R. » Fri. Sep. 22, 2023 1:09 pm

Sunny Boy wrote:
Fri. Sep. 22, 2023 11:39 am
I understand about constant temps below the frost line. My question is, can it supply enough BTU's ? I've heard complaints that some heat pump systems need other forms of heat with our winters here in the North. How good are heat pump systems even further north ?

Plus, looking at installation costs, they seem to be a rather expensive way to save money. If they are so super-efficient, why don't we see more of them being installed in colder climates like around here ? :roll:

Paul
Hi Paul - most of the complaints I have heard about heat pumps are Air to Air units. It makes sense to me that it is hard to extract much heat out of subzero air. The ground-source units don't have the same issue, but you are correct about the cost. The ROI is very long, and most people can't afford the upfront expense.


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