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Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Tue. Nov. 15, 2022 3:56 pm
by hotblast1357
Rob R. wrote:
Mon. Nov. 14, 2022 7:04 pm
Now that the cold weather is upon us I wondered how you were making out with the heat pumps?
I wanted to hold out longer, but I disconnected the downstairs radiators and replumbed them last week as part of finishing downstairs, so I fired the boiler up Sunday, didn’t want to wait till It got too cold to find leaks, with nights in the teens I probably was probably pushing it with the boiler freezing anyways.. I will use the heat pumps to bump up the temps in the evening instead of turning up the thermostats and using coal.

I have no dought they can handle this weather.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 11:05 am
by McGiever
ColdHouse wrote:
Sat. Oct. 29, 2022 10:36 am
I had every intention of using heat pump this time of year but the Trane kicks into Auxiliary heat mode when outside temperatures are below about 40*.
More than likely that 40 degree aux. switch over is a "installer setting"...they hate call backs for a cold house. Point is is that it is only a setting and settings can be changed within economical limits.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 11:18 am
by k-2
hotblast1357 wrote:
Tue. Nov. 15, 2022 3:56 pm
.. I will use the heat pumps to bump up the temps in the evening instead of turning up the thermostats and using coal.
I have no dought they can handle this weather.
Do some calculations on that,last time i checked coal would have to be $1000 a ton to be more costly than electric and electric is still going up .Ours will be jumping 15% on Dec 1st.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 12:40 pm
by LouNY
k-2 wrote:
Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 11:18 am
Do some calculations on that,last time i checked coal would have to be $1000 a ton to be more costly than electric and electric is still going up .Ours will be jumping 15% on Dec 1st.
Good timing,
I'll have to disagree with you on the cost of heating though.
I was just on the phone with my brother this morning and running numbers through the calculator on this site.
Electricity @ $0.18kwh with 250% efficiency equaled $2110 per million btu,
Fuel Oil (currently) @ $5.80 gal with 80% efficiency equaled $5227 per million btu,
Fuel oil (what I paid) @ $4.05 gal with 80% efficiency equaled $3650 per million btu
Coal @$450 ton with 75% efficiency equaled $2400 per million btu

So right now my mini-splits are a few hundred dollars less per million btu then my coal would be and a lot less then my oil.
And much less work just set and forget, that said.
It would be warmer in here with the coal going and it's a nicer heat.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 1:09 pm
by k-2
LouNY wrote:
Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 12:40 pm
Good timing,
I'll have to disagree with you on the cost of heating though.

Coal @$450 ton with 75% efficiency equaled $2400 per million btu
Ok i paid about half that for my coal so my calculations are different. Plus whether the electric is resistance or heat pump makes a huge difference as well.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 1:27 pm
by LouNY
Certainly makes a difference resistance electric in the above example would be $5275

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 4:06 pm
by ColdHouse
LouNY wrote:
Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 12:40 pm
Good timing,
I'll have to disagree with you on the cost of heating though.
I was just on the phone with my brother this morning and running numbers through the calculator on this site.
Electricity @ $0.18kwh with 250% efficiency equaled $2110 per million btu,
Fuel Oil (currently) @ $5.80 gal with 80% efficiency equaled $5227 per million btu,
Fuel oil (what I paid) @ $4.05 gal with 80% efficiency equaled $3650 per million btu
Coal @$450 ton with 75% efficiency equaled $2400 per million btu

So right now my mini-splits are a few hundred dollars less per million btu then my coal would be and a lot less then my oil.
And much less work just set and forget, that said.
It would be warmer in here with the coal going and it's a nicer heat.
So long as your numbers for KW are calculated from the bottom line. Take your total electric bill and divide that by the number of kwh used. In my scenario I cannot just figure the cost for the KWH because the delivery fees cost more than the kwh. In my case my net cost per kwh is $0.275.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 4:07 pm
by ColdHouse
McGiever wrote:
Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 11:05 am
More than likely that 40 degree aux. switch over is a "installer setting"...they hate call backs for a cold house. Point is is that it is only a setting and settings can be changed within economical limits.
Thanks! I will ask the guy that installed it.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 9:40 pm
by LouNY
ColdHouse wrote:
Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 4:06 pm
So long as your numbers for KW are calculated from the bottom line. Take your total electric bill and divide that by the number of kwh used. In my scenario I cannot just figure the cost for the KWH because the delivery fees cost more than the kwh. In my case my net cost per kwh is $0.275.
That is what I do every month when I pay the bill.
And yes the delivery and service charges are more then the so called electricity cost.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Fri. Nov. 18, 2022 1:52 am
by k-2
My electric from PPL in eastern central Pa is 18c all in, but will be going up to 21c Dec 1st. Unless i can find a supply generator for less. Was 12c 2 yrs ago

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Sun. Nov. 20, 2022 6:06 pm
by Col'_got_to_be
Here on Long Island the power company provides a rebate of about $1,000/ton heat output at 22*F (as I recall). The Bosch 4-ton IDS 2.0 I had installed a few weeks ago along with Wi-fi thermostat will result in about a $3,800 check.

My ducted A/C system was about 18 years old and slightly undersized, the rebate just about covered the labor. Parts were about $8,000 (numbers I got searching the net).

In addition, the power company charges a lower electric rate all winter long. Electricity is expensive here, so any savings will help. Hopefully rates don't go up like k-2 said about PA!

Today home heating oil is $4.94/gallon!!

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Sun. Nov. 20, 2022 6:09 pm
by Col'_got_to_be
ColdHouse wrote:
Thu. Nov. 17, 2022 4:06 pm
...I cannot just figure the cost for the KWH because the delivery fees cost more than the kwh. In my case my net cost per kwh is $0.275.
Same here! What the heck is "delivery charge"?

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Sun. Nov. 20, 2022 6:26 pm
by nut
Poles, wires, etc.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Sun. Nov. 20, 2022 6:58 pm
by k-2
Col'_got_to_be wrote:
Sun. Nov. 20, 2022 6:06 pm
In addition, the power company charges a lower electric rate all winter long. Electricity is expensive here, so any savings will help. Hopefully rates don't go up like k-2 said about PA!
Today home heating oil is $4.94/gallon!!
Heating oil Over $6 here. People are lined up to switch to Natural Gas. Its an hour wait just to talk to someone on the phone about it. Then another 12 weeks until you get on the list to start digging. Not surprising their (Gas Compnay )stock is also jumping. I bought some last week and sold it when it went up a little,then went up $2 more the same day. :lol: Shoulda Coulda woulda i guess.

Re: Heat Pumps

Posted: Sun. Nov. 20, 2022 7:12 pm
by Col'_got_to_be
nut wrote:
Sun. Nov. 20, 2022 6:26 pm
Poles, wires, etc.
Yes, but have a separate line item for that? Include it into the price per kWh. It's not like delivery is optional, lol.
k-2 wrote:
Sun. Nov. 20, 2022 6:58 pm
Heating oil Over $6 here. People are lined up to switch to Natural Gas. Its an hour wait just to talk to someone on the phone about it. Then another 12 weeks until you get on the list to start digging.
Wow! $4.94/gallon is my COD price. Some are locked in at $6.50 (contract). Here we have no natural gas service, but my neighbors with new homes have 1,000 gallon propane tanks buried. It looks like propane hasn't gone up like oil has.

EDIT: Can they dig frozen ground for a winter install? Or are they looking at the spring? I've heard about some areas having a natural gas scarcity as well.