Burn time on your parlor or cylinder stove
- swattley01
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- Stoker Coal Boiler: Alaska Gnome 40
- Baseburners & Antiques: Buckwalters Vale Oak 315
- Coal Size/Type: nut / rice
- Other Heating: March Brownback potbelly #12
what is the burn time on a full bed of coal on your antique cylinder type stove? i been working with my Vale oak-16 and making improvements over the years, i know the diameter of the stove will vary burn time . mine is a 16 inch and i added fire brick mortar to help preserve the fire box cast iron. i struggle to go to bed at lets say 11pm and be able to shake down and add coal and keep it going in the morning. i think my fire box can take 30 lbs of coal now. i have made big improvements in the burn rate or air intake by using a baro damper and this year modify flat modern window gasket to seal the ash door. my coal supplier thinks maybe 30lbs of coal would last 10 hours. and feels i am about at the limit. i thought this would be a interesting post.
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30 pounds seems low for a 16 inch fire pot. Sunny Boy (Paul) reports his Glenwood 6, holds about 50 pounds. There is no getting around the fact that at a certain burn rate you need enough coal to last.
- michaelanthony
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I am very rigid and stick to a 12 hr schedule...or 11hr...or 13hr, ok you get my drift. I could get 20+ hrs but who likes to test fate and then have to light up again. I get up in the morning, shake and load, come home from work, shake and load. 10 - 14 hrs
- swattley01
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- Stoker Coal Boiler: Alaska Gnome 40
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- Coal Size/Type: nut / rice
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my point is i can load the fire box to the top at 11:pm and in the morning i can not keep the fire going. it is full 9 inches of hot ash. i have been fighting this for 3 years. this is my main source of heat in this off grid cabin. not once since i purchased this place have i been able to keep the fire burning more then one night
- michaelanthony
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Try mixing the 'nut coal with some pea size to slow it down...how deep is the fire pot? At 16 inches wide and let's say 10 inches deep you should be able to put 40lbs in it mounded up in the center.
- Sunny Boy
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- Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
- Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
I agreed.
A typical 16 inch Oak stove firepot, with about a 1 inch thick liner puts you in the Glenwood #6 and Modern Oak 116 size range of holding about 50 pounds of nut coal. If the stove is in good shape, and the chimney system has decent draft, than at least 12 hours burn times (and longer) should be doable.
If your trying to heat a large area and that's pushing the stove to it's limit, than that trades off length of burn time for lots of heat output.
There are some tweaks and tips for extending the length of overnight burns, but after all that, there's only so much BTU's in a given amount of coal, no matter how you burn them.
If you list how your setting the dampers, when and how your clearing ash, how much coal your adding to what level, we may be able to help you fine tune that to get the most out of your stove - which by the way, Vale Oaks are one of the better stoves and certainly up to the task. And a 16 inch pot Oak is no "light weight" when it comes to heating !!!!
Paul
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I have a Florence 153 I run all winter. Normally on the 12 hour schedule. I did line the fire pot and it still holds around 50lbs. I normally burn 40lbs a day. Usually only run stove around 325 at barrel. I did have some trouble figuring out the correct setup. For me I shut secondary air all the way off. Adding pea does help if you need a long burn. I’ve went 20 hours before and still had a fire running about 200 at the barrel.
- swattley01
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- Stoker Coal Boiler: Alaska Gnome 40
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- Coal Size/Type: nut / rice
- Other Heating: March Brownback potbelly #12
it has a coating of the refactor cementmichaelanthony wrote: ↑Sun. Feb. 11, 2018 7:34 pmTry mixing the 'nut coal with some pea size to slow it down...how deep is the fire pot? At 16 inches wide and let's say 10 inches deep you should be able to put 40lbs in it mounded up in the center.
- swattley01
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- Posts: 76
- Joined: Mon. Nov. 17, 2014 7:35 pm
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Alaska Gnome 40
- Baseburners & Antiques: Buckwalters Vale Oak 315
- Coal Size/Type: nut / rice
- Other Heating: March Brownback potbelly #12
i wonder if i have made a mistake after hearing everybody, i think the inside measured 16" and i will check this and post the exact measurement. but i believe on the front of the stove under the main door it says 315. what does that tell you?Sunny Boy wrote: ↑Sun. Feb. 11, 2018 8:08 pmI agreed.
A typical 16 inch Oak stove firepot, with about a 1 inch thick liner puts you in the Glenwood #6 and Modern Oak 116 size range of holding about 50 pounds of nut coal. If the stove is in good shape, and the chimney system has decent draft, than at least 12 hours burn times (and longer) should be doable.
If your trying to heat a large area and that's pushing the stove to it's limit, than that trades off length of burn time for lots of heat output.
There are some tweaks and tips for extending the length of overnight burns, but after all that, there's only so much BTU's in a given amount of coal, no matter how you burn them.
If you list how your setting the dampers, when and how your clearing ash, how much coal your adding to what level, we may be able to help you fine tune that to get the most out of your stove - which by the way, Vale Oaks are one of the better stoves and certainly up to the task. And a 16 inch pot Oak is no "light weight" when it comes to heating !!!!
Paul
- Sunny Boy
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- Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
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If the 315 follows model number convention of the time, I'd say it's a stove in the manufacturer's 300 series, with a 15 inch diameter firepot.
Some like Glenwood, went by the outside diameter of the firepot top edge. For instance the #6 is actually 15-1/2 inches inside the top of the pot, but it's called a 16 inch firepot.
Typically, fireclay brick linings are about 1 inch thick. That seems to be the best compromise for heat retention in the firebed while maintaining as much space for fuel as possible.
So the actual inside diameter of a #6 with original lining thickness is 13-1/2 inches at the top.
I've measured the amount of coal my #6 holds with it's new firebricks and without the magazine. It's 50 pounds of nut coal and 46 pounds of stove sized coal.
The stove coal I used for the weight test was bagged Blaschak that had a lot of small pieces in it. Without as much small pieces, it was 45 lbs.
Paul
Some like Glenwood, went by the outside diameter of the firepot top edge. For instance the #6 is actually 15-1/2 inches inside the top of the pot, but it's called a 16 inch firepot.
Typically, fireclay brick linings are about 1 inch thick. That seems to be the best compromise for heat retention in the firebed while maintaining as much space for fuel as possible.
So the actual inside diameter of a #6 with original lining thickness is 13-1/2 inches at the top.
I've measured the amount of coal my #6 holds with it's new firebricks and without the magazine. It's 50 pounds of nut coal and 46 pounds of stove sized coal.
The stove coal I used for the weight test was bagged Blaschak that had a lot of small pieces in it. Without as much small pieces, it was 45 lbs.
Paul
- joeq
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I'm glad you posted this thread SW, cause if the members with these stoves would participate, it could be very beneficial, and maybe shed some light on the reality of these stoves. I don't think there have been too many complaints over heat out-put. From what I hear, (and experience myself), burn times has always been the complaint, or rewards of the fortunate or knowledgeable ones.
You mention your stove only holding 30 lbs with a 15-16" pot. You might want to go back and re-check all your numbers. My G111 will hold that, and maybe a tad more, and the pot is only 10" x 12" tall. "Normally", (and I say that lightly), the 111 will go 10-12 hrs, unattended, and will still be recoverable. (Altho lately I ran into problems).
However, now that things are back on track, the experienced members that are giving you advice, have also helped me. And the advice they've given to so many people, has also worked for me. This is my current procedure, to get through the night, and daytime work hrs.
B4 going to bed, and you know you have a decent coal bed burning, toss on some fresh stuff 1st, and wait for some blues. Then de-ash it the best you can. Not sure what the best method is for your stove, but mine is a combination of poking/riddling at grate level, shaking, and maybe even flossing depending. Then fill the pot to the brim, and then some while keeping the stove wide open till the blues appear.
And it seems with my stove, doing this with nut, (not stove size coal), makes a noticeable difference. Of course you need to turn the dampers down low to let it live, once things are up and runnin.
I was told the Oak stoves aren't base burners, and often wondered if my fire would go longer in BH mode, or DD. I'll be watching your thread with bated breath, to see what kind of improvements you can obtain. And with a 15" pot, you should be stylin. (Good luck, and I apologize for the extended response)
P.S. some pics of your set-up would sure be nice.
You mention your stove only holding 30 lbs with a 15-16" pot. You might want to go back and re-check all your numbers. My G111 will hold that, and maybe a tad more, and the pot is only 10" x 12" tall. "Normally", (and I say that lightly), the 111 will go 10-12 hrs, unattended, and will still be recoverable. (Altho lately I ran into problems).
However, now that things are back on track, the experienced members that are giving you advice, have also helped me. And the advice they've given to so many people, has also worked for me. This is my current procedure, to get through the night, and daytime work hrs.
B4 going to bed, and you know you have a decent coal bed burning, toss on some fresh stuff 1st, and wait for some blues. Then de-ash it the best you can. Not sure what the best method is for your stove, but mine is a combination of poking/riddling at grate level, shaking, and maybe even flossing depending. Then fill the pot to the brim, and then some while keeping the stove wide open till the blues appear.
And it seems with my stove, doing this with nut, (not stove size coal), makes a noticeable difference. Of course you need to turn the dampers down low to let it live, once things are up and runnin.
I was told the Oak stoves aren't base burners, and often wondered if my fire would go longer in BH mode, or DD. I'll be watching your thread with bated breath, to see what kind of improvements you can obtain. And with a 15" pot, you should be stylin. (Good luck, and I apologize for the extended response)
P.S. some pics of your set-up would sure be nice.
- swattley01
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- Posts: 76
- Joined: Mon. Nov. 17, 2014 7:35 pm
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Alaska Gnome 40
- Baseburners & Antiques: Buckwalters Vale Oak 315
- Coal Size/Type: nut / rice
- Other Heating: March Brownback potbelly #12
next time i get to the cabin i am going to measure the exact measurements top and bottom of my fire box now after the fire brick mold. the cabin is snowed in right now but i would like to see this post continue and see others experience, i love the old stoves. the cabin is set in that same time frame it is off grid and lit by many original working oil lamps from the early 1900s
- Vermont_Woodchuck
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My stove has a cylindrical fire pot diameter of ten inches. Accounting for the refractory liner inside, diameter is reduced to about eight inches. From the grate to the bottom of the load door is twelve inches. This stove heats my cabin of 300 square feet in southern Vermont. Average outside temperature during the winter is thirty degrees. Several nights per winter will get down to ten below zero. Fully loaded, the stove takes about fifteen pounds of coal and easily keeps my cabin at seventy-four degrees. (Shorts and t-shirt weather.)
I get recoverable burn times of at least twelve hours. If I'm patient, I can recover after an eighteen-hour burn. The stove will continue to put out some usable heat after a twenty-four hour burn, but I have to dump it and start all over.
Of course, instantaneous heat output is inversely proportional to burn time. So my question to you is, what is the temperature inside your cabin? Too hot, too cold? Do you have to open windows?
If I need quick heat on a cold day, I will start a fire with nut coal (due to the increased draft through the nut coal.) If I'm just maintaining my fire, I will maintain it with pea coal. When my cabin is at the proper temperature, I will add a one-inch layer of rice coal at the top. With the pipe damper shut all the way and the air inlet shut all the way, the rice reduces the draft so that the stove just sort of idles and puts off a nice, gentle heat that will maintain the temperature inside the cabin. The good thing about using a layer of rice on top is that, if I add it at ten pm, and if I expect it to be colder outside in the morning than it is at ten pm, that layer of rice will start to burn after about four hours, which increases draft and, thus, heat output of the stove just when I need it most: at sunrise. So essentially, you're using that combustible rice coal top layer as an automatic pipe damper that increases draft just when you need it: at 3 am.
If I get up in the morning and I expect it to be in the forties or higher that day, I will not shake down and reload the stove. I will slap the top layer of coal with the little coal shovel. That's like a half shakedown. That causes char and ash to fall toward the grate, and it makes the top layer of coal descend by an inch or two. That gives me room to throw a couple shovels of coal to the top. Then I close down all drafts. That will keep the cabin at temperature during the warmer part of the day. When I come home from work eight hours later, I shake down completely and reload fully.
So that is my personal experience with my stove.
I get recoverable burn times of at least twelve hours. If I'm patient, I can recover after an eighteen-hour burn. The stove will continue to put out some usable heat after a twenty-four hour burn, but I have to dump it and start all over.
Of course, instantaneous heat output is inversely proportional to burn time. So my question to you is, what is the temperature inside your cabin? Too hot, too cold? Do you have to open windows?
If I need quick heat on a cold day, I will start a fire with nut coal (due to the increased draft through the nut coal.) If I'm just maintaining my fire, I will maintain it with pea coal. When my cabin is at the proper temperature, I will add a one-inch layer of rice coal at the top. With the pipe damper shut all the way and the air inlet shut all the way, the rice reduces the draft so that the stove just sort of idles and puts off a nice, gentle heat that will maintain the temperature inside the cabin. The good thing about using a layer of rice on top is that, if I add it at ten pm, and if I expect it to be colder outside in the morning than it is at ten pm, that layer of rice will start to burn after about four hours, which increases draft and, thus, heat output of the stove just when I need it most: at sunrise. So essentially, you're using that combustible rice coal top layer as an automatic pipe damper that increases draft just when you need it: at 3 am.
If I get up in the morning and I expect it to be in the forties or higher that day, I will not shake down and reload the stove. I will slap the top layer of coal with the little coal shovel. That's like a half shakedown. That causes char and ash to fall toward the grate, and it makes the top layer of coal descend by an inch or two. That gives me room to throw a couple shovels of coal to the top. Then I close down all drafts. That will keep the cabin at temperature during the warmer part of the day. When I come home from work eight hours later, I shake down completely and reload fully.
So that is my personal experience with my stove.
- Keepaeyeonit
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- Location: Northeast Ohio.( Grand river wine country )
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #8
- Coal Size/Type: Nut & stove
- Other Heating: 49 year old oil furnace, and finally a new heat pump
My #8 is 15 1/2" at the top X 11" deep( liner dimensions ) so I'm guessing it holds around 65# of coal. I tend mine at 12 hr intervals ( but in reality its anywhere from 9 to 18 hrs ) after the 20+ hrs ashing becomes the problem .
I never had to run the #8 over 435° to keep the house hot like the others like it, I'm running around 375° to 400° and burning 45 to 50#'s of stove in 24 hrs.
If I get a magazine I will go back to nut as the recovery time will be much faster with the coal already preheated.
I never had to run the #8 over 435° to keep the house hot like the others like it, I'm running around 375° to 400° and burning 45 to 50#'s of stove in 24 hrs.
If I get a magazine I will go back to nut as the recovery time will be much faster with the coal already preheated.
- michaelanthony
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I ran a little less than 2 tons of stove coal in my base burner. I kept my house nice and toasty as long as I stayed on a 12 hour shake and load. The stove held about 25 - 30 lbs of coal in a 10 inch wide, (originally 12 inch minus 1 inch of refractory all around), and 12 inches deep. The stove laughed at the bitter cold we had a few weeks ago. I am now running 'nut coal and it will hold 35 lbs when starting fresh. I add approx. 15 lbs every 12 hr shake and load and the heat out put is excellent. I can slow the stove down quicker with the 'nut coal and I am getting less ash because of the slower more dense fire pot.