Glenwood 116 to Help Out Little Tiget

Sunny Boy · Post by **Sunny Boy** » Sun. Dec. 10, 2017 11:24 am

Wren wrote: ↑
Sun. Dec. 10, 2017 10:57 am
I thought it had to be shaking down ash that brought live coal to ruin my pan, because where else would it come from, but I always stop shaking as soon as I see the first live ash or light from above because I read long ago( one year soon) that a certain amount of ash on my grates is good.
So happens I have my feet up and am beginning a Harry Potter because my youngest has told me to, and I could hear chunks of charcoal falling into my precious pan. Usually we are moving around and I don’t hear it I guess.
Too bad I started cleaning out the fire pot completely in the morning if restarting, instead of leaving everything but the ash that would fall through the grates as I used to.
That’s too bad, but at least I know how it happened now. Not that the pan is ruined but I can see light through in one area. Yeesh . No more charcoal on my grates. WHAT was I thinking.

I wouldn't get too worried about starting a fire with charcoal. Many of us do.

And a few hot coals landing in the ash pan is no big deal. It would take a lot to burn through it. Are you saying there is a hole through the pan ? Could it have been caused by rust ?

As for leaving a lot of ash on the grates, yes, some types of grates need that protection. But, it takes a lot to hurt triangular grate bars. Remember that, unlike most other designs of grates, the triangular ones extent down a lot in cross section. As hot as the top surface of those triangular bars are getting, there are two equal sized surfaces getting cooler incoming air drawn over them. Just make sure to rotate them at least once every day, don't ever try to force a jam through and they should last a lifetime.

Paul

joeq · Post by **joeq** » Sun. Dec. 10, 2017 2:21 pm

What Paul said. I've had too many red hot coals drop into my pans, and never did any damage. But I do think I remember someone saying it was beneficial to leave a layer of ash for protection, but that might not've been in reference to an ash pan.

Wren · Post by **Wren** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 7:16 pm

Tiny little holes just centre right but you can’t see it unless you hold it up to the sky. I’m pretty sure it was not like that when I got it. Oh heck. I don’t turn the grates I just rock them so they don’t get stuck. But how else would there be holes? Rust, you say? I wonder. Charcoal is okay on the grates? Well I don’t know then. Still sad about the holes. I should turn the grates? Groan. They always get stuck.

joeq · Post by **joeq** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 7:21 pm

Jen, I think what you're doing by rocking is preferred. The only time you would want to rotate them, is if the top side is wearing, and you want another side up for the coal bed. And because your grates are cast iron, and not sheet metal, that's why they hold up better. At least that's my take on it. Course I'm usually wrong, so don't mortgage your house on it.

Sunny Boy · Post by **Sunny Boy** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 8:23 pm

Sorry to correct you Joe, but the bars need to be rotated daily to even out the heat stress.

If that's not done, by the time you see "wear" on the top side of triangular grates it'll be too late. They will very likely be warped/bowed upward so much that when you try to turn them they will hit and not be able to turn. Plus, being warped, when you rock them to drop ash the gaps between them will be increased by the curvature because they are bowed. Then they will drop good coal too.

Been there !!!!! I've got sets of the warped grate bars from both my range and my 118's that previous owners only "rocked".

Jen,
If the bars jam when you rotate them , you've likely turned them too soon, or too much. Wait until the ash bed is deeper - such as first thing in the morning after an overnight fire before you do any ash shaking. And, don't turn them slowly or too much ash may have time to fall through. Plus, you only need to turn them once, or at most twice if the ash bed is really deep, or you'll bring the still burning coals down to where they can jam.

If you do get coal jamming them open, STOP! Don't force them to turn and don't try to rotate them backwards to undo a jam. Just leave the grate bars in the position they are for an hour or so and let the stuck piece of coal burn to ash. Then you can finish rotating them to flat sides up

Then you can do the ash shaking.

In the Cookin' With Coal thread is a copy of the directions Randy found from Clarion for their range grates. It explains how and when to rotate the grates.

Paul

Sunny Boy · Post by **Sunny Boy** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 8:30 pm

Wren wrote: ↑
Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 7:16 pm
Tiny little holes just centre right but you can’t see it unless you hold it up to the sky. I’m pretty sure it was not like that when I got it. Oh heck. I don’t turn the grates I just rock them so they don’t get stuck. But how else would there be holes? Rust, you say? I wonder. Charcoal is okay on the grates? Well I don’t know then. Still sad about the holes. I should turn the grates? Groan. They always get stuck.

If they are that tiny, it's most likely rust pin holes. The pin holes probably still had rust, or ash in the holes when you got it and your use loosened it

Hot embers with enough heat to melt through the pan would show a larger melted hole with heat warping of the sheet metal around the hole.

Paul

joeq · Post by **joeq** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 8:45 pm

Sunny Boy wrote: ↑
Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 8:23 pm
Sorry to correct you Joe, but the bars need to be rotated daily to even out the heat stress.
Paul

No need to apologize Paul, cause I'm glad you corrected me. That's why we're all here, to not only be entertained, but educated. I now have a different out-look on those prismatic grates. They sound like a PITA, if they jam with coal, and you can't rotate them. Especially if they warp that easily. If you have to wait for the ash to turn to powder, I would think the coal bed would be pretty lethargic, and take longer to recover? Or am I out in left field with Carl Yastremski on that one too?
(By the way Paul, You got another TOTP.

)

joeq · Post by **joeq** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 8:46 pm

joeq wrote: ↑
Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 8:45 pm
No need to apologize Paul, cause I'm glad you corrected me. That's why we're all here, to not only be entertained, but educated. I now have a different out-look on those prismatic grates. They sound like a PITA, if they jam with coal, and you can't rotate them. Especially if they warp that easily. If you have to wait for the ash to turn to powder, I would think the coal bed would be pretty lethargic, and take longer to recover? Or am I out in left field with Carl Yastremski on that one too?

Sunny Boy · Post by **Sunny Boy** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 9:00 pm

joeq wrote: ↑
Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 8:45 pm
No need to apologize Paul, cause I'm glad you corrected me. That's why we're all here, to not only be entertained, but educated. I now have a different out-look on those prismatic grates. They sound like a PITA, if they jam with coal, and you can't rotate them. Especially if they warp that easily. If you have to wait for the ash to turn to powder, I would think the coal bed would be pretty lethargic, and take longer to recover? Or am I out in left field with Carl Yastremski on that one too?
(By the way Paul, You got another TOTP. )

It's ok, Joe.

Triangular grates are not that bad. Like any grate system, you just have to learn how to use them correctly. Because the triangular grates are so rugged and clear ash and clinker so well, many manufactures went to using that type in their later coal stove designs. ...including in large coal furnaces.

And it would take a long time of not rotating them while you are waiting for them to "wear". But once they do, then it's too late.

Paul

Wren · Post by **Wren** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 9:29 pm

Well I am glad you discussed that, you two. I won’t feel terrible about the pan but I will rotate the grates.
Minus 16 Celsius I think 3 Fahrenheit and the Glenwood is loaded for the night. Texting and loading don’t mix-the fire pot is pink a little.
TOTP. Lol.

joeq · Post by **joeq** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 10:56 pm

That TOTP response needs to be eliminated. I boned up on it "real bad".

Post by **franco b** » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 11:16 pm

Just want to clarify that what Paul means by rotate is to rotate to the next face by a one third turn. Not rotate 180 or more degrees.

My Glenwood 114 is very easy to rotate, even all the way around because the coal would bridge easily with the brick lined pot which was now 12 inches. Shake and rotate, then give a poke to get the coal to drop and a few more short shakes.

Sunny Boy · Post by **Sunny Boy** » Tue. Dec. 12, 2017 8:43 am

Thank you Richard. Yes, by rotation I mean one firebed supporting surface of the grates is one rotation. 120 degrees for the triangular grates and 180 for flat grates such as the dockash type (see picture below).

Some types, like the combo wood/coal grates, or those in Coal Stove Ladies kitchen range, because they are basically one-sided coal grates, they only get rotated 90 degrees to dump clinkers, and then back 90 degrees to support the firebed.

Jen,
I know you and I have discussed this about your new range. But, now that you have two stoves with triangular grates, remember the firebed depths are different. You'll likely only need to do a 120 degree rotation once a day with the kitchen range's shallower firebed. And maybe two rotations with the deeper bed of the 116. The timing depends on how hot you run them and how soon that builds up a deep bed of ash. Once I got new grates that worked I found once first thing in the morning works very well to do all the clearing needed without risk of a jam.

Some mornings, if I sleep late, the ash bed is deep enough that I can get two rotations before I start to see a hint of glow in the ash pan. If I did another rotation after that first glimmer of orange, it would very likely jam with still burning coals before I could complete the 120 degree turn. So, the trick is to only rotate the grates when the ash bed is so deep that there is no glow showing anywhere in the ash pan.

When you rotate them remember to always turn them so that the top of the outer grate bar goes inward toward the middle of the firebed. That's to pull the ash away from the sides of the firepot. Rotating them the other way could pack ash up against the firepot and start to choke off the sides of the firebed.

For the Glenwood range, that means only turn the handle clockwise from the 12:00 position down to 4:00.

For the two geared sets in the 116, the right hand grate bar gets turned clockwise - 12:00 to 4:00, and the left hand bar gets turned counterclockwise - 12:00 to 7:00. Then do the ash shaking.

And I can't stress it enough that it should only be done after a long run, when the ash bed is at it's deepest to avoid getting the firebed so low that live coals can get stuck in the grates. After an overnight run. And for those who go off to work all day, it can be done again when they get home. That will keep the firebed clear of "clinkers and slate" to use the terms in the Clarion grate operation instructions.

I wish we could find similar grate operating instructions for Glenwoods.

Paul

joeq · Post by **joeq** » Tue. Dec. 12, 2017 6:05 pm

Who needs operating instructions, when we got you Paul?

Post by **franco b** » Tue. Dec. 12, 2017 8:01 pm

Yes I learned something new about rotating the left pair of grates counterclockwise on a two pair set of triangular grates

Glenwood 116 to Help Out Little Tiget

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