Our Glenwood 109

 
KingCoal
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Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Sat. Jan. 21, 2017 7:09 am

yep yep yep,

filters are ultra important. even if you are just regularly do the floors or carpet. if your filters aren't at peak you can watch the dust coming out the exhaust stream real easily.

you might as well "winnow" the ash pan of fly ash right in the front room.


 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25559
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Sat. Jan. 21, 2017 8:40 am

The best drywall dust vac system I ever used for sanding and cleaning up spackle dust was one of those inexpensive kits to use with a shop vac that has the water bucket in the hose lines. No dust and no filter needing to be replaced. Just dump the water and dust down the drain, or out in the weeds.

You can make one, too. http://toolguyd.com/shop-tip-5-gallon-bucket-diy-fine-dust-collection-trap/

And if you know anyone that does swimming pool cleaning and maintenance, the 5 gallon pails that the chlorine comes in have nice screw-on lids, so you don't have to fight with the snap-on type 5 gallon bucket lids. My brother got me a few from a neighbor in that line of work and those type buckets are much easier to use the covers on.

Paul

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25559
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Sat. Jan. 21, 2017 8:43 am

KingCoal wrote:yep yep yep,

filters are ultra important. even if you are just regularly do the floors or carpet. if your filters aren't at peak you can watch the dust coming out the exhaust stream real easily.

you might as well "winnow" the ash pan of fly ash right in the front room.
Job security for the cleaning crew. :D

Paul

 
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tcalo
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Location: Long Island, New York
Baseburners & Antiques: Crawford 40
Coal Size/Type: Nut/stove anthracite

Post by tcalo » Sun. Jan. 22, 2017 11:08 pm

I took the baro off my flue over the weekend to experiment, been having some dust issues. We're getting some high winds starting up from the storm headed our way. My mano reading has been bouncing around like a grasshopper! You don't realize how well the baro works at keeping a steady draft.

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25559
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 6:35 am

The plus and minus affect of that bouncing doesn't affect the fire as much as the mano would lead you to think it is.

Manos are very quick to respond to the slightest pressure changes, but the fire is far slower. The end result is that those pressure swings cancel each other out before the fire can do any change.

Wanna see an example of that slow reacting ? Shut the primary damper completely and see how long it takes a coal fire to die out. ;)

With some test gauges they are purposely "dampened" to prevent showing those types of quick changes in readings that don't have any real value for testing purposes. By having the gauge react more slowly it can only show real change and thus give more meaningful info. If there was a way to dampen the mano by using a very narrow tube, like a copper capillary tube that some use, you would see only more of an average of changes in draft - the type of changes that are really having an affect on the fire.

So, don't let wildly bouncing mano readings fool you into thinking the draft can make the fire do the same. With a wood fire, possibly, but coal fires react much too slowly to draft changes for it to make a difference. ;)

Paul

 
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Lightning
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Location: Olean, NY
Stoker Coal Boiler: Modified AA 130
Coal Size/Type: Pea Size - Anthracite

Post by Lightning » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 7:20 am

I agree with how the fire responds, but couldn't a spike yank some hot gases out of the stove that would otherwise radiate some heat to the stove?

 
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freetown fred
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Post by freetown fred » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 7:25 am

Maybe, but I don't think any of us are smart enough to calibrate all that. It'd just be guessin. Plus, what good would that knowledge be??????????? As in, it is what it is.


 
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Sunny Boy
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Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 7:38 am

While it may look like a lot of change on the gauge, those draft pressure differences inside the stove and chimney system are very slight. So slight that you couldn't feel them. However, you can go outside and easily feel the wind that is causing those, which can also be misleading about what affect it is really having inside the stove.

Next time the mano is doing the storm dance, try measuring the temperature difference at the surface of the stove pipe and see how much it shows a change in heat transfer. ;)

Paul

 
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Lightning
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Post by Lightning » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 8:04 am

I'm sure it's not much unless it spikes for long periods of time. :)

 
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Lightning
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Post by Lightning » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 8:12 am

freetown fred wrote:Maybe, but I don't think any of us are smart enough to calibrate all that. It'd just be guessin. Plus, what good would that knowledge be??????????? As in, it is what it is.
That's what's beautiful about a baro. You don't have to be smart, the baro does the calibrating for you.

 
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Sunny Boy
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Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 8:23 am

Single wall stove pipe skin temps can show changes in flue gas heat transfer fairly quickly.

If the wind gusts were having much affect on heat transfer to be concerned about, you should be able to see the affect of it at the pipe surface using an IR gun.

When it's really gusting and the mano is dancing, using my IR gun I've never seen the pipe skin temp readings show a more than the usual variation of a couple of degrees F, plus or minus.

Keep in mind that while a mano is very useful, it is only showing part of the picture. ;)

Paul

 
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windyhill4.2
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Coal Size/Type: 404-nut, 520 rice ,anthracite for both

Post by windyhill4.2 » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 9:17 am

You non-believers of a baro can argue all you want against the benefits of a baro..

A windy day like we are currently having here,20 mph constant wind with gusts up to 45-50 mph will make anyone a believer in the benefits of a baro.... if they have any brains ;) ;) ;)

My baro can't even keep after with these winds,even with the baro doing it's best my stove still fires harder with the normal setting.

Baro on hand fed stove with no bi-metallic air damper = easy control. :)

 
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Sunny Boy
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Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 9:39 am

windyhill4.2 wrote:You non-believers of a baro can argue all you want against the benefits of a baro..

A windy day like we are currently having here,20 mph constant wind with gusts up to 45-50 mph will make anyone a believer in the benefits of a baro.... if they have any brains ;) ;) ;)

My baro can't even keep after with these winds,even with the baro doing it's best my stove still fires harder with the normal setting.

Baro on hand fed stove with no bi-metallic air damper = easy control. :)
So people were stupid before baros came along ? Or did they just get stupid and forget how to build stoves and chimneys that worked fine without need of a baro ? :roll:

Paul

 
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tcalo
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Post by tcalo » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 10:05 am

Antique stoves were designed with features to help maintain a steady draft, long before the barometric damper came about. Features such as manual check dampers on the rear elbow and internal check dampers on suspended pot stoves, not to mention manual pipe dampers in the flue. Our ancestors were smart folks. This isn't to say that the baro is useless, I think it's a great piece of equipment! In fact I plan on putting it back on, just after the stove cools down a bit. I'm afraid my cats are going to get sucked into the stove if they get too close... :lol:

 
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Sunny Boy
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Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Mon. Jan. 23, 2017 10:22 am

The longer flue paths in many older stoves not only adds resistance to slow the hot gases down to transfer more of their heat it, also reduces the affect that wind gusts can have on a stove.

On a windy night, candle flames flicker in my drafty, leaky old Victorian home, but it doesn't bother the coal stove because of the long flues inside the stove, plus being able to produce a lot of heat output with fairly small primary and MPD openings and having a tall, good drafting chimney that is well clear of any wind turbulence near the roof.

If you've ever used one of those antique punched tin candle lanterns on a windy night you'd see the similar affect - all those tiny holes make it so that they are impossible to blow the candle out, yet there are enough holes to throw a surprising amount of light.

The old timers seem to have done well knowing what worked best with coal. And a few generations after coal fell out of favor we seem to have forgotten much of it. :(

Paul


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