Call for Glenwood Back Pipe Project

Learn the ins and outs of designs that date back to the turn of the last century. Whether you are looking to restore an antique stove or have questions about modern reproductions you'll find the answers to your questions here.
stovehospital
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Posts: 222
Joined: Sat. Jun. 25, 2011 7:00 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: 250 stoves in barns
Stove/Furnace Model: #6 Herald baseheater

Post Tue. Feb. 25, 2014 7:21 pm

The modern oaks all have back pipes that are dedicated to one size only. If you recast the 118 I suggest you thicken it a little bit with bondo. Helps in the long run. That back pipe was also used in the City Glenwood coal stoves so you may find one there as well.
The earlier versions do not interchange parts with the later ones. You need to find a 40 back pipe to recast a new one. the modern version does not fit. I have( I think) a 40 back pipe that could be used as a pattern if someone needs it. I may also have the 30 size as well.


Sunny Boy
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Posts: 12585
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
Location: Central NY

Post Wed. Feb. 26, 2014 5:44 am

blackrock wrote:I got the back pipe apart and it's all in good shape. It's complete with no cracks etc. Although, the very bottom of the big flat cast divider is a little warped. Is that a problem? Can I straighten it out with a little heat and some finesse? Or is that a no no? What do you guys think??

Vance
Vance,

Can you post pictures of the divider to show how much it's warped ? Maybe the foundry can give you a better answer if it can be straightened ?

Paul
So many stoves - so few chimneys. I must be coal-stone crazy.

Sunny Boy
Member
Posts: 12585
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
Location: Central NY

Post Wed. Feb. 26, 2014 5:45 am

stovehospital wrote:The modern oaks all have back pipes that are dedicated to one size only. If you recast the 118 I suggest you thicken it a little bit with bondo. Helps in the long run. That back pipe was also used in the City Glenwood coal stoves so you may find one there as well.
The earlier versions do not interchange parts with the later ones. You need to find a 40 back pipe to recast a new one. the modern version does not fit. I have( I think) a 40 back pipe that could be used as a pattern if someone needs it. I may also have the 30 size as well.
Thanks for the heads up about what fits.

Thicken which parts and where ?

Paul
So many stoves - so few chimneys. I must be coal-stone crazy.

stovehospital
Member
Posts: 222
Joined: Sat. Jun. 25, 2011 7:00 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: 250 stoves in barns
Stove/Furnace Model: #6 Herald baseheater

Post Wed. Feb. 26, 2014 6:33 am

I seems best to thicken the whole divider except where the flapper fits and whee it plugs into the base unit. I will be doing the 30 unit myself in a month or two.

Sunny Boy
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Posts: 12585
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
Location: Central NY

Post Wed. Feb. 26, 2014 6:51 am

Good idea.

Thickening the divider with plastic filler may also be a way to eliminate, or at least, reduce any slight warping without risk of cracking the divider by trying to straighten it.

Paul
So many stoves - so few chimneys. I must be coal-stone crazy.

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blackrock
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Location: Maine

Post Wed. Feb. 26, 2014 7:38 pm

That is a good idea. What about shrinkage? I would think the sheet metal could be made to fit the re cast part right? At the same time it still needs to fit the other mating parts. The 6" cast pipe adapter thingy has a pretty good fit from the factory to the back pipe itself. That would have to be maintained too. Will the small flapper and the divider shrink at the same rate? I know the bigger the part the more it will shrink. Something like .125 per foot?? It would stink to get a bunch of parts back that no one can use. I have no experience with what would work and what wouldn't. Just thinking outloud... I'm hoping to have some prices on Friday from Tomahawk.

Vance

Sunny Boy
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Posts: 12585
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
Location: Central NY

Post Wed. Feb. 26, 2014 8:05 pm

Vance,

I'm not sure. All the info I've seen says cast iron shrinks 1/8 inch per foot. However, the new cast iron grates I got for my 118 from Bryant Stove are almost two feet long. They said they were cast using an original set of 118 grates, so the new ones should be almost 1/4 inch shorter than originals. They aren't. They are only about 1/8 inch shorter than my original grates.

Donna at Bryant said they use two foundries. Not sure which one did these grates.

I think the best answer is to ask Tomahawk how much to compensate when you talk to them Friday.

Paul
So many stoves - so few chimneys. I must be coal-stone crazy.

dhansen
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Posts: 228
Joined: Mon. Dec. 10, 2012 3:51 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: Glenwood No.6 and No.116
Location: Spruce Head, Maine

Post Wed. Feb. 26, 2014 10:39 pm

Sunny Boy wrote:Vance,

I'm not sure. All the info I've seen says cast iron shrinks 1/8 inch per foot. However, the new cast iron grates I got for my 118 from Bryant Stove are almost two feet long. They said they were cast using an original set of 118 grates, so the new ones should be almost 1/4 inch shorter than originals. They aren't. They are only about 1/8 inch shorter than my original grates.

Donna at Bryant said they use two foundries. Not sure which one did these grates.

I think the best answer is to ask Tomahawk how much to compensate when you talk to them Friday.

Paul
I saw Basil making a pattern from a broken grate on one of my trips up there. It would be very easy to make them a little longer when putting the broken parts back together. Might have done that with yours?

Dennis


Sunny Boy
Member
Posts: 12585
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
Location: Central NY

Post Thu. Feb. 27, 2014 6:39 am

dhansen wrote:
Sunny Boy wrote:Vance,

I'm not sure. All the info I've seen says cast iron shrinks 1/8 inch per foot. However, the new cast iron grates I got for my 118 from Bryant Stove are almost two feet long. They said they were cast using an original set of 118 grates, so the new ones should be almost 1/4 inch shorter than originals. They aren't. They are only about 1/8 inch shorter than my original grates.

Donna at Bryant said they use two foundries. Not sure which one did these grates.

I think the best answer is to ask Tomahawk how much to compensate when you talk to them Friday.

Paul
I saw Basil making a pattern from a broken grate on one of my trips up there. It would be very easy to make them a little longer when putting the broken parts back together. Might have done that with yours?

Dennis
Dennis,

Yes, the two middle grate bars show signs of repair to some of the damaged triangular teeth. But the two outer grate bars show no signs what-so-ever of damage, or having been cut, repaired, lengthened, or any material added to the ends.

And adding material to the ends wouldn't work because there is a flange to locate the gears on one end, and two flanges on the other end that straddle the rack to keep the bars in position in the rack. Material would have to be added in between those points to keep the bars close to alignment in the rack. Nothing has been added. The spacing of the teeth, and the shaft lengths in between the teeth and the locating flanges, are exactly proportional to my originals - just scaled down so that the bars are about 1/8 inch shorter over-all.

Paul

Paul
So many stoves - so few chimneys. I must be coal-stone crazy.

dhansen
Member
Posts: 228
Joined: Mon. Dec. 10, 2012 3:51 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: Glenwood No.6 and No.116
Location: Spruce Head, Maine

Post Thu. Feb. 27, 2014 8:31 am

I was thinking material added to the center of the grate but if the spacing between the triangles is all equal then that seems unlikely. I should have asked more specific questions!

Dennis

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blackrock
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Location: Maine

Post Sun. Mar. 02, 2014 4:35 am

Just thought of something. How do I get all that bondo off my original without wrecking it?? I plan on using it. It's perfect except for a little warping on the bottom. Or would it be better to use one of the re cast ones so I/we can get as much of a seal as possible? It's at the very bottom where it flows thru the hole and underneath so I don't think the small warping would matter. Or does it?

Sunny Boy
Member
Posts: 12585
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
Location: Central NY

Post Sun. Mar. 02, 2014 7:44 am

Vance,
If the new dividers fit better than the warped one, plus being thicker, . . . if I were you, I'd use one of those. At the very bottom, the divider has to fit into slots in the base. If it's off, it may distort and not let the pipe seat well. Can you post pictures showing where and how much it's warped ?

Getting plastic filler off can be done a number of ways. Either a wood rasp file, chipping with chisels, sanding, sandblasting, or paint stripper.

Paul
So many stoves - so few chimneys. I must be coal-stone crazy.

wilsons woodstoves
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Joined: Mon. Dec. 16, 2013 7:55 pm
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood, Crawford, Magee, Herald, Others

Post Sun. Mar. 02, 2014 1:02 pm

heat,,,,, lay It on top off a runing stove, does no have to be real hot. the bondo will peel of easy

Sunny Boy
Member
Posts: 12585
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
Location: Central NY

Post Mon. Mar. 03, 2014 8:46 am

wilsons woodstoves wrote:heat,,,,, lay It on top off a runing stove, does no have to be real hot. the bondo will peel of easy
Ahhhh, the smell of cooking fresh polyester fiberglass resin, with a dash of methyl ethyl ketone peroxide added for spice ! :D

Paul
So many stoves - so few chimneys. I must be coal-stone crazy.

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blackrock
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Location: Maine

Post Mon. Mar. 03, 2014 6:45 pm

Hey everybody. Thanks for the input. With the added research of adding filler to the thin/warped spots it will prob. be a little while before I can get anywhere on the casting project. Seems like off season is when people do the restoring fixing up and adding the little extras to there stoves anyway but I know you guys want it now!! :D I would. I'll deff. get it done. I'm going to check out the back pipe assembly on the other one and see how it looks. By the way, I brought a third 118 home Friday... Guys at work say that's not normal. I guess I agree. Hows a man supposed to live with only 3 of them?? :shock:


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