Why so hard to find electricians

 
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VigIIPeaBurner
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Post by VigIIPeaBurner » Mon. Aug. 14, 2017 11:02 pm

Good point McG. My dad was knowledgeable in DC and AC, industrial and residential. I've seen the E&I guys at work pull off some amazing stuff. Hard to replace that kind of experience. Arc-flash is extremely dangerous. Sad to see everyone at my place of employment (for the next 10 days!) in demolition mode.


 
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Post by McGiever » Tue. Aug. 15, 2017 11:41 am

In construction (commercial industrial) contracts are won with lowest bid, so busting azz is all the contractor wants to see. Funny thing is that older guys make work look too easy and younger guys make a lot of motion but not always produce much. Guess who the superstars are?

But don't get me started about contractors...

 
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Post by davidmcbeth3 » Thu. Aug. 17, 2017 5:07 am

McGiever wrote:Being an "electrician" is a very broad term. <snip>.
That's what I tell the wife.

"Hire an electrician" she says

I go into the basement and an electrician emerges !

Fingers....fuses made by God.

 
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Post by CapeCoaler » Thu. Aug. 17, 2017 10:58 pm

I get to set up the programing on a CO sensor on a commercial kitchen...
Because nobody wants to touch it...
The guy who installed it said not my job to program it...
The other contractor is his competition and won't touch it...
The electrician won't touch it because it is a 'computer'...
Now the electrician is an old school navy kinda guy and wired the hood so it all works to code...
but needs this sensor/computer to do its thing when the CO hits certain break points...
and sets into motion his electrical mouse trap...
Makeup air motors stop, exhaust motors run and gas valve closes...
Without this sensor working the Fire inspector won't pass the install and the kitchen will not operate...
So he called me up and asked if I could figure it out...
Hell yes, RTFM and a phone call to the manufacturer of the sensor...
I am also known as the guy to call when you need something done, when others have waved off the job...
Good news is that the installer has several customers hanging with non programed sensors...
Better news they have to be inspected every 6 months for function and tested... ;)
So some recurring work for me!
Good electricians that do it right the first time are few and far between...
Most want quick and fast...
Then there are the specialists: underground, service, commercial, residential, handyman...
It takes hard work and commitment to do any trade properly...
Most people want the easy way to the big bucks...
The schools don't help most of the regular schools have closed their 'shop' offerings...
I could have built a 22 ft fiberglass boat in shop when we moved to The Cape...
But sadly was not made aware of it in time to elect it in my courses...
We do have two excellent Tech Schools here though...
So their is hope that the trades will have a good supply of journeymen ready people...

 
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Post by charlesosborne2002 » Wed. Aug. 22, 2018 7:48 pm

I teach college. When I was young, most people wanted a liberal arts degree, and nobody asked "What do plan on doing with it?" Now, even the state Board of Regents say the purpose of college is to provide corporations with trained labor.

But worse--now they all major in Being The Boss. They think if you majored in Being The Boss, you can run a chain of chili parlors or an airline with equal ease. Whether it is Leadership or Management, what most companies really need is well trained followers. Demand for leaders is declining, while demand for followers is rising.

 
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Post by freetown fred » Wed. Aug. 22, 2018 7:52 pm

Yep C, to many Chiefs & not enough Indians--history proves what happened there!!! :(

 
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Post by lsayre » Thu. Aug. 23, 2018 6:27 am

The old school method of tudoring an apprentice via on the job training and as an understudy was a more effective business solution to achieve adequate employees than the hiring of college certified idiots.


 
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Post by titleist1 » Thu. Aug. 23, 2018 2:29 pm

My job has me working with many system integrators that do control work for industry and municipalities. They are all crying for qualified technicians.

Currently going through college mode now with the kid.

I noticed there are some colleges offering payment plans on "loaned" money that is a percentage of your income (capped) for a set term (also capped) and a capped total payment amount.

The idea is that the college now has a vested interest in training you with relevant skills and developing networks in the various industries that help with job placement in good paying jobs.

Seems like it would be better than collecting money for meaningless degrees and then dumping graduates on the street. Sounds good in theory, not sure how well it will work.

 
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Post by warminmn » Thu. Aug. 23, 2018 3:10 pm

lsayre wrote:
Thu. Aug. 23, 2018 6:27 am
The old school method of tudoring an apprentice via on the job training and as an understudy was a more effective business solution to achieve adequate employees than the hiring of college certified idiots.
I mostly agree. For many jobs that is a great way to learn. With low unemployment in many areas employers are doing that more now. A little votech beforehand helps a lot too. Carpenter or building type jobs work good for this. Natural resource type jobs would be good this way except they need a degree before you can saw a log up that fell over a creek :lol:

If something interests someone, really interests them, you can self teach yourself a lot of it, or apprentice type work. If your just doing it for $$$, go to college and good luck.

The military can be a good way sometimes. I know if for some reason I had wanted to be a Dr, thats the only way I could have afforded the training.

 
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Post by charlesosborne2002 » Sat. Aug. 25, 2018 9:56 am

"If something interests someone, really interests them, you can self teach yourself a lot of it, or apprentice type work. If your just doing it for $$$, go to college and good luck.

The military can be a good way sometimes. I know if for some reason I had wanted to be a Dr, that's the only way I could have afforded the training."

In the past, people went to school to learn the "Three R's"--readin', writin', and 'rithmetic." In ancient Greece, it was the "3 D's"--Duty, discipline, and decorum. Today it is the "Three M's"--Money, more money, and all the money.

What we should learn in school is how to learn, and why--and this is not possible if we put self first above all else. Only when you learn to sacrifice your own pleasures and interests for something greater (your art or your science) will you benefit from instruction. Education majors today put the interests of students first, with no mention at all of advancing their arts or their sciences. The Great Truth is real--it is only in giving that we receive.

 
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Post by samhill » Sun. Aug. 26, 2018 6:59 am

I told my grandson to follow his passion (which was law) after two years at Penn State & then being enticed by Pitt & put into pre-med he has two minors & started his next three years at Duquesne for his Law degree but all his grants have run dry so it's loan time with interest compounded daily (there ought to be a law about that)! The sad part I see is if there are jobs in a certain field now by the time someone finishes school or training those jobs are gone. I taught field work for the boilermaker apprenticeship program before U.S.S. quit it but I still think that was the way to go, there's a lot to be said for both classroom & OJT for trades.

 
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Post by swyman » Tue. Sep. 18, 2018 3:14 am

I live near the heart of the auto industry. Grew up on a family farm with that being my life path till grandpa told me to go and get a winter job at Tecumseh Products, a local factory that made refrigeration compressors. Seen a guy working in a panel and asked what he was doing and that conversation changed my life. He told me all about his trade and the other trades that we had at that facility. I had no idea what skilled trades were...thank you high school! I took the apprenticeship test and scored really high and got in within a year. The company paid for all schooling plus my regular wage for every hour in class. Once getting my journeyman's card I immediately started handing out resume's to the "Big 3" which was about the top of the food chain for my trade. Took 1 year of trying before Ford hired me. I now work for FCA and have been a journeyman Millwright for 24 years. We recently had a town hall and here is an interesting fact they told us....our average skilled trades age at this plant is 52 years old! Who is going to replace me? Around here in the early 90's when I was fresh out of high school there were all kinds of "Tecumseh Products" shops that offered apprenticeships' but they are all gone! Tecumseh Products moved South and the building right now is in a pile of rubble being torn down.....this building had about 40 acres under roof! Where are the kids, my kids, going to go to get these good jobs that will always need tradesmen to do? It is a sad time, I wish I was smart enough to build a school as an option for high school kids to go to that specialized in trades, that would work with the local halls and get a solid introduction and possible job placement as an alternative to a 4 year degree. I wish my boys could have the same opportunities but the odds are really against them.

 
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Post by europachris » Tue. Sep. 18, 2018 11:25 am

You make a good point, Swyman! We as a country have lost so much manufacturing that many of these types of jobs are long gone. Technology has also eliminated many of these jobs as well. Industrial control systems have become like cars - if it doesn't work, replace it. Tech help? HAH! Those jobs went overseas as well and and rarely does the "help" have a real clue. A lot of the manufacturing that is left is merely assembly of foreign-sourced parts.

Kids don't grow up taking apart lawnmowers and building go-karts anymore. They don't get to watch Dad wrenching on the family car or tractor because Dad hasn't a clue (and cars aren't simple like they used to be). Even if the kids go to school with a math/science focus, they still don't know which end of a screwdriver to hold. Many companies won't hire manufacturing or process engineers without a degree, but it is rare to find one that is a "gearhead" as well and really understands equipment.

Lastly, many companies today see the maintenance department as just an "expense", rather than an asset. Always strive for the minimum to get the job done - minimum staff, minimum parts, minimum equipment, minimum training, basically one step above the janitor, but then get all the blame when something breaks down. I know I'd make a great maintenance manager but I couldn't deal with the corporate mentality of "we'll fix it when it breaks" and then having to deal with "why did it break down and when will you get it fixed?" rather than developing a solid P.M. program that would have detected the imminent failure and set forth a proactive replacement.

 
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Post by KLook » Tue. Sep. 18, 2018 4:33 pm

Lastly, many companies today see the maintenance department as just an "expense", rather than an asset. Always strive for the minimum to get the job done - minimum staff, minimum parts, minimum equipment, minimum training, basically one step above the janitor, but then get all the blame when something breaks down. I know I'd make a great maintenance manager but I couldn't deal with the corporate mentality of "we'll fix it when it breaks" and then having to deal with "why did it break down and when will you get it fixed?" rather than developing a solid P.M. program that would have detected the imminent failure and set forth a proactive replacement.
This is exactly what I experienced in a Corporate prison system company.They wanted me to be able to do everything, and I damned near could, but the pay and benefits were less then I made 40 years before when I was just young and strong and learning.

Kevin

 
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