Coal vac build 101

Post Reply
 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Mon. Dec. 10, 2018 7:20 am

Got an early start Saturday morning, rolled, welded, and painted my ring to support the 30 gallon platic drum. I also managed to build the support frame attached to the floor joists.... more pics to come...didn't get as much done as I wanted but made some progress...
20181208_084917.jpg
.JPG | 617.8KB | 20181208_084917.jpg


 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Sun. Dec. 23, 2018 1:07 pm

1545588304790854182470133923912.jpg
.JPG | 406.8KB | 1545588304790854182470133923912.jpg
154558832979959932544868912107.jpg
.JPG | 572.2KB | 154558832979959932544868912107.jpg
15455883579114917297327087323968.jpg
.JPG | 378.9KB | 15455883579114917297327087323968.jpg
This coal vac doesn't suck.....but I need it to! Very slow, trying to figure next option.....another dust deputy and vac? That's how I'm leaning?

 
Kungur
Member
Posts: 722
Joined: Thu. Sep. 25, 2008 7:09 am
Location: Chardon,Ohio

Post by Kungur » Sun. Dec. 23, 2018 3:03 pm

I had the same situation. I tried with one but it really didn't cut it. So my current setup is 2 vacs with filter bags and one vac has a Dust Deputy. I will check in the next few days to see how much each filter bag if filling up. So I may be going fo a second Dust Deputy.
The "Y" at the wand intrigue me. Right now I am using 1.5" PVC with a .5" piece of PVC installed with a 90 degree elbow about 12" from the end.

 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 8:39 am

Kungur wrote:
Sun. Dec. 23, 2018 3:03 pm
I had the same situation. I tried with one but it really didn't cut it. So my current setup is 2 vacs with filter bags and one vac has a Dust Deputy. I will check in the next few days to see how much each filter bag if filling up. So I may be going fo a second Dust Deputy.
The "Y" at the wand intrigue me. Right now I am using 1.5" PVC with a .5" piece of PVC installed with a 90 degree elbow about 12" from the end.
Kunger, I am going to do the same thing since I have a second vac at home and just add a Wye and hook the other vac direct to see the difference it makes. Have one on a dust deputy now and amazed at how fine of dust the cyclone picks up.....it's like black baby powder! I still have 2 major issues that I do not like.....still have the fines....lots of them and dust! My coal is so dusty that I would make a dust cloud in my coal bin just scooping a 5 gallon bucket. Granted the vac system solved this problem but when my 30 gallon drum gets full and I shut off the vac so I can release it into the coal hopper I get a cloud of dust as it flows into the hopper. I guess if I kept the hopper full it wouldn't drop in so far which should alleviate most if not all the dust since it wouldn't be falling but I would really like to get to where the vac system cleans my fines out as it transfers. I was successful in doing this with my corn vac system but I had a lot of room to work with and build that oversized chamber with a screen it to remove all the fines but I simply don't have the headroom now. One thing I was thinking of doing was misting water on my coal bin before I transfer it with the vac just to eliminate the dust? Open for any and all ideas???? One thing I tried but forgot to mention is leaving the vac on while I opened the blade valves to empty the drum so it would suck up the dust but it had enough suction to hold the coal in the drum.

 
User avatar
McGiever
Member
Posts: 10130
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Coal Size/Type: PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar

Post by McGiever » Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 10:38 am

swyman wrote:
Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 8:39 am
Open for any and all ideas????
One thing I tried but forgot to mention is leaving the vac on while I opened the blade valves to empty the drum so it would suck up the dust but it had enough suction to hold the coal in the drum.
How about add a couple valves with one on a tee branch and instead of turning off the vac motor just close one valve and open the other for suction of airborne dust during drop-out. :annoyed:

 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 11:30 am

McGiever wrote:
Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 10:38 am
How about add a couple valves with one on a tee branch and instead of turning off the vac motor just close one valve and open the other for suction of airborne dust during drop-out. :annoyed:
That would work and I also thought of making a lid and that would act as a hood. Just want to get this working, I will be able to go a couple days once it's right without refilling!

 
User avatar
nepacoal
Member
Posts: 1696
Joined: Wed. Nov. 21, 2012 7:49 am
Location: Coal Country
Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KAA-4 / "Kelly" and an EFM 520 at my in-laws
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Harman SF-260 - retired
Coal Size/Type: Buck

Post by nepacoal » Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 12:58 pm

The bulk Lehigh buck doesn't seem to have much dust or fines at all... Plus I do reload as soon as I notice the load box on my coalvac is empty. That might be the key to the low dust on mine... the hopper never really gets too empty. A hood would make sense if you are seeing that much dust and might be the easiest thing to set up...


 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 1:00 pm

nepacoal wrote:
Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 12:58 pm
The bulk Lehigh buck doesn't seem to have much dust or fines at all... Plus I do reload as soon as I notice the load box on my coalvac is empty. That might be the key to the low dust on mine... the hopper never really gets too empty. A hood would make sense if you are seeing that much dust and might be the easiest thing to set up...
I should have done a video but now that I have 3 ton fresh out of the super sack, it was wet so I shouldn't have any dust for a while.

 
Kungur
Member
Posts: 722
Joined: Thu. Sep. 25, 2008 7:09 am
Location: Chardon,Ohio

Post by Kungur » Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 1:08 pm

My hopper empties into the boiler hopper via a 4" PVC pipe. I enclosed the top of my boiler hopper to contain the dust as it fills after I shut off the vacs. I have an access door with weather stripping. It works! No dust escapes.

 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 1:18 pm

Kungur wrote:
Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 1:08 pm
My hopper empties into the boiler hopper via a 4" PVC pipe. I enclosed the top of my boiler hopper to contain the dust as it fills after I shut off the vacs. I have an access door with weather stripping. It works! No dust escapes.
Thanks Kungur, that was a route I was looking into or just keeping the thing filled. Would really like to figure out a way to remove the fines though.

 
User avatar
McGiever
Member
Posts: 10130
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
Coal Size/Type: PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar

Post by McGiever » Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 5:13 pm

swyman wrote:
Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 1:18 pm
Thanks Kungur, that was a route I was looking into or just keeping the thing filled. Would really like to figure out a way to remove the fines though.
More power at the vac gets proportionally bigger dust particles...short of that, there's not many good options.

 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Sun. Dec. 30, 2018 8:26 am

McGiever wrote:
Sat. Dec. 29, 2018 5:13 pm
More power at the vac gets proportionally bigger dust particles...short of that, there's not many good options.
I'm at work and only have to do "rat patrol"! There are only 2 of us maintenance people here just as an insurance policy if we break a pipe or something........have lots of time to research vacuum's!

 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Mon. Dec. 31, 2018 7:02 am

Been searching like a crazy on vacs, I have kind of changed my way of thinking into buying one with the best static pressure. Best I have been able to find with a 2 1/2" hose is 75. There are some 2 stage lower hp units that go up to 90. Any thoughts? Was really thinking of like a HF dust collector but those are just very high flow, almost no static pressure so a shop vac type it is....but which one?????

 
User avatar
lsayre
Member
Posts: 21781
Joined: Wed. Nov. 23, 2005 9:17 pm
Location: Ohio
Stoker Coal Boiler: AHS S130 Coal Gun
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Anthracite Pea
Other Heating: Resistance Boiler (13.5 KW), ComfortMax 75

Post by lsayre » Mon. Dec. 31, 2018 8:16 am

I don't know if this matters, but if an analogy to a pump was to be drawn with a vacuum device, static pressure would be the vacuum equivalent of pump head, and CFM would be the vacuum equivalent of pump GPM. It would seem from this that (although static pressure and CFM are related) CFM is (initially at least) the most critical factor with regard to energy. And it is energy that moves things forward in the face of roadblocks (wherein static pressure is akin to the systems roadblock).

If vacuum companies are stating static pressures at all, they must be quoting them in relation to a fixed hose diameter and a fixed straight run hose length. There can be no such fixed or intrinsic value as "static pressure" in and of itself, as it is purely a "derivative" value. Thus, since your complex system will by no means match the overly simplistic system (pipe diameter and hose length) through which the vacuum manufacturer arbitrarily derived (the derivative part) their quoted "static pressure", you have no way of knowing your systems inherent static pressure.

If you are flying blind (and you are), then it seems that the only solution is to select the vacuum source which first offers the highest CFM, and only second offers the highest arbitrary manufacturers rating for static pressure (but beware here of the hose diameter). As hose diameter increases, static pressure decreases. As elbows and bends and length increase a systems static pressure dramatically increases, while at the same time its CFM dramatically decreases.

A vacuum with a narrow hose and the same CFM rating as for a vacuum with a wider hose is the stronger vacuum of the two, presuming that hose length was identical for both manufacturers while they established their ratings.

 
User avatar
swyman
Member
Posts: 2355
Joined: Mon. Apr. 13, 2015 9:50 pm
Location: Blissfield, MI
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman-Anderson 260M Leisure Line AA-220 Boiler (FOR SALE)
Coal Size/Type: Lehigh Pea

Post by swyman » Mon. Dec. 31, 2018 9:12 am

Exactly what I was thinking Larry! But in regards to cfm vs static pressure, I have watched a few videos (which doesn't make me an instant expert) in dust collector vs shop vac. The HF 2hp dust vac has a claimed 1500 cfm with a 4" inlet. Now I could run a 4" from my barrel to the collector but reduced down to 2" going to the coal bin. I read a forum thread where the guy bought the HF collector and it came with a Wye that reduces from 4" to 2 2" ports. The fellow, much like me thought that by simply reducing would increase velocity but in reality took away quite substantially. He could not get it to move the material his shop vac could, not even close. The static tests that they run on the vacuums is a no flow situation and it brings a water column up until it stops which in the case of Shop Vacs website for the best ones with a 2 1/2" hose is 72". That is about as high as my vertical draw to my horizontal pipe, Not stating this is 100% correct way of thinking but I am kind of looking at this from a hydraulic pump perspective, thinking that a shop vac is sort of in a way related to a positive displacement pump (low flow/high pressure) vs a centrifugal pump (high volume/low pressure). I think I need that high pressure to lift but also the high volume to transfer. Shop vac has an industrial version with a brushless motor that has 240 cfm and 70" of static pressure.....or a couple 150 cfm and 72" static pressure. I would think the 2" of static pressure would be overcome with the extra 90 cfm of the first example? I know we don't know all my variables but I am using their performance numbers as a starting point. I would really like to go with that big HF unit but I do not want to make the mistake of no performance which has been the case in the articles I have read. Boy I love this stuff, it's even better when it works. Have always looked at things with the attitude....Plan your work, then work your plan! Another thing to mention on the collector vs shop vac is when the collector system was left at 4" or expanded to 6", it worked very well for moving large amounts of dust but when reduced down to hook into a hand held power tool it would not work. I just don't think it could lift the heavy coal up 6' before moving horizontal?


Post Reply

Return to “Coal Bins, Chimneys, CO Detectors & Thermostats”