Want to supplement my Geothermal heatpump
I live in southwestern PA. I have been thinking about adding a supplemental heat source to my geothermal hvac. It is a forced air system that is located in my basement. It is able to heat better than conventional electric heat pumps, but in the dead of winter, it does get overwhelmed and turns on the electric auxilliary heat which is $$$$$$$$. Anyway, I do not have a way to add a chimney so I was thinking of adding an anthracite coal system and use the thru the wall vent system. If I add one, is there a way to get the heat from the coal throughout my house? I kinda thought I would be able to tap into my main outflow ductwork and let the gravity heat make it out through the home? Or, I could tap into the return ducting so that it goes through the filters and then gets pushed through the home by the existing furnace blower if I leave it in the on position. Would I need the coal furnace to have it's own blower or look for one that is just basic gravity flow? I have a 2200 sq ft ranch that has a well insulated, superior wall full basement under it. There is also approx 200 sq ft of bonus room space that is on a second level above the main level that I would love to be able to heat too. It has a separate zone of existing ductwork to it from the geothermal unit. I have no idea if this will harm my furnace at all by adding an external heat source into existing ducts. I can't imagine it would.
I know there are a bunch of questions that might come back at me, but shoot them this way and I'll field them. Thanks for any and all input.
I know there are a bunch of questions that might come back at me, but shoot them this way and I'll field them. Thanks for any and all input.
- philthy
- Member
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- Location: Newville PA
- Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Keystoke Koker Lite, Alaska Kast Konsole
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6, Glenwood #116 x 2, Crawford 40
Either or. You could get a properly sized stove/furnace with a large enough blower and tie into the outflow. Or, you could run it into the return and have it wired so that when a target temp is reached it kicks on the main furnace fan to distribute it through the home. Some don't like it done that way and some do but I think it would be fine.
There is about a hundred different ways you could go about it. Lucky for you you've come to the right place for information. Give it a little, others will be along to help out.
There is about a hundred different ways you could go about it. Lucky for you you've come to the right place for information. Give it a little, others will be along to help out.
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- Joined: Wed. Apr. 09, 2008 7:05 am
- Location: Geauga County, NE Ohio
- Hot Air Coal Stoker Furnace: Keystoker Koker
- Coal Size/Type: rice
Welcome to the coal forum. You've come to the right place to get answers/opinions on everything related to burning coal.
For what it's worth, my situation is similar to yours, except my heat source was propane.
We decided to install a Keystoker Koker furnace in the basement. The salesman/installer connected the Koker's heat output into the propane furnace cold air return and wired the Koker's convection blower to turn on the propane blower. I questioned this arrangement at the time but he insisted it was the correct way to do it. Well, it turned out to be wrong in a few different ways and after the first winter season, I reinstalled the furnace, connecting the Koker's heat duct to the propane furnace plenum and the convection blower to the existing cold air return run. This does require dampers between the Koker and the propane furnace to separate the two systems. During this reinstall I also went through the duct system sealing up all my connection points for maximum efficiency. So today, when the thermostat calls for heat and the Koker blower comes on I get hot air coming through all the vents throughout the house. When the blower isn't running, I still have heat rising through the warm air vents.
My wife and I have been very happy with the coal furnace.
Here's some background on my coal furnace experience:
My Koker Experience (So Far) II
Good luck with your project!
-Len
For what it's worth, my situation is similar to yours, except my heat source was propane.
We decided to install a Keystoker Koker furnace in the basement. The salesman/installer connected the Koker's heat output into the propane furnace cold air return and wired the Koker's convection blower to turn on the propane blower. I questioned this arrangement at the time but he insisted it was the correct way to do it. Well, it turned out to be wrong in a few different ways and after the first winter season, I reinstalled the furnace, connecting the Koker's heat duct to the propane furnace plenum and the convection blower to the existing cold air return run. This does require dampers between the Koker and the propane furnace to separate the two systems. During this reinstall I also went through the duct system sealing up all my connection points for maximum efficiency. So today, when the thermostat calls for heat and the Koker blower comes on I get hot air coming through all the vents throughout the house. When the blower isn't running, I still have heat rising through the warm air vents.
My wife and I have been very happy with the coal furnace.
Here's some background on my coal furnace experience:
My Koker Experience (So Far) II
Good luck with your project!
-Len
- McGiever
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- Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
- Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV
- Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
- Coal Size/Type: PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE
- Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Sure it can be done...you want good, better or best?
- philthy
- Member
- Posts: 163
- Joined: Sat. Nov. 09, 2013 9:15 pm
- Location: Newville PA
- Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Keystoke Koker Lite, Alaska Kast Konsole
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #6, Glenwood #116 x 2, Crawford 40
Separating the furnaces can be a pain if you don't have the right tools but a little creativity goes a long way. This is how mine is set up - going into plenum. I have a koker lite which will not keep in weather like we had over the past 2 weeks so being able to separate between coal furnace and oil furnace is important. My thought is if you bought a furnace that you know will carry the load 100% of the time you wouldn't have to worry about dampers because your geo-thermal would never kick on. Like I said, I have the koker lite. But the full size koker might do the trick. There are several other makes that others can recommend.CoaLen wrote: ↑Sun. Jan. 07, 2018 8:19 amWell, it turned out to be wrong in a few different ways and after the first winter season, I reinstalled the furnace, connecting the Koker's heat duct to the propane furnace plenum and the convection blower to the existing cold air return run. This does require dampers between the Koker and the propane furnace to separate the two systems.
- McGiever
- Member
- Posts: 10130
- Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
- Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV
- Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
- Coal Size/Type: PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE
- Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
Tom, would also having the DHW being heated at the same time be an attractive bonus?
- BlackBetty06
- Member
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- Location: Lancaster county PA
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 50-93
- Coal Size/Type: Stockton Nut
- Other Heating: Jotul 118b woodstove, dual fuel heat pump/condensing propane furnace
Whatever you do, DO NOT HOOK THAT COAL STOKER UP TO THE RETURN SIDE OF THE HEATPUMP!!! You will drive your head pressure up astronomically and cause high pressure lockouts all the time and or a ridiculously high standing pressure. Im assuming also that your geo is R410A which will make the pressure higher yet.
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- Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: LL AnthraKing 180K, Pocono110K,KStokr 90K, DVC
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- Coal Size/Type: Rice,
- Other Heating: Heating Oil CH, Toyotomi OM 22
AK110/Pocono, SWG, all driven by a thermostat/coaltrol. Search this board. Hot air rises and the forced air already moving will fix everything and save a ton of electricity. That is it lights out. ROI 3/5 years. Quick, not cheap .. you know the saying pick two out of three.
- McGiever
- Member
- Posts: 10130
- Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
- Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV
- Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
- Coal Size/Type: PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE
- Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
I have Geo also, and with used rebuilt stoker coal boiler. Plumbed in a coal boiler zone to a air over water coil in return air duct and use the HP thermostat's Aux Ht setting to trigger HP Relay to the zone pump...Geo compressor is disabled. Works a treat and was a DIY job for myself, so wasn't any more cost than a new stove/furnace install. Plumbed a second zone to a indirect HW tank and carry that load there also all winter...bought indirect used off Craigslist too.
Come summer I run the AC flat out so saving a lot of HP wear and tear plus saving big on electric w/ coal carrying all that load all thru winter was a great ROI.
Come summer I run the AC flat out so saving a lot of HP wear and tear plus saving big on electric w/ coal carrying all that load all thru winter was a great ROI.
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Im surprised to hear GEO users switching to coal. I was under the impression BTUs from GEO were on par with coal. Unless of course the unit is a bit undersized and the back up resistance heat comes on a lot driving up the cost back up closer to electric resistance heat.
- windyhill4.2
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- Coal Size/Type: 404-nut, 520 rice ,anthracite for both
Some folks like WARM heat,not that COOL heat from those heat pumps.k-2 wrote: ↑Tue. Jan. 09, 2018 10:12 amIm surprised to hear GEO users switching to coal. I was under the impression BTUs from GEO were on par with coal. Unless of course the unit is a bit undersized and the back up resistance heat comes on a lot driving up the cost back up closer to electric resistance heat.
- McGiever
- Member
- Posts: 10130
- Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
- Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV
- Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: BUCKET A DAY water heater
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Warm Morning 414A
- Coal Size/Type: PEA,NUT,STOVE /ANTHRACITE
- Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump and some Solar
I'll give vou that!
Few ever hear good talk about HP, but few really know more than what they hear, but I digress...
Few ever hear good talk about HP, but few really know more than what they hear, but I digress...
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For the cost of those things 15 to 30K. I know a few people who have em ,but if your like my family that likes the place 80 degrees all winter ,may not be the best choice.windyhill4.2 wrote: ↑Tue. Jan. 09, 2018 11:48 amSome folks like WARM heat,not that COOL heat from those heat pumps.