Help me get my Grandmother burning coal

 
fastlane4
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Post by fastlane4 » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 7:42 pm

rjc862003 wrote:
Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 6:39 pm
that chimney is a fire waiting to happen (seriously thats up there in some of the worst I have seen)

a block-off plate is fine do not skimp on the sealant

draft will do a lot but better safe then dead

here is a tip if you can extend the side of the thimble going up the chimney by one or two length of pipe then (optional)

cut two 4 or 6 inch holes on either-side and get your self matching thimbles (please do this if you go for a semi non removable plate )


as a further measure you may want to support the block off plate from the bottom with either pipe or a stack of bricks
I have also seen them hinged with concrete anchors and a fiberglass/or heavy wide rope seal
so the entire thing can be dropped down and out of the way for cleaning and inspection
The chimney has been cleaned. I had just pulled the insert out to take pictures. It looks like that every year before I let her start burning. I clean the hell out of it and only burn seasoned wood. Just another reason to stop fooling with wood.

I like the idea of using a hinged plate. Would definitely make future access much easier.

I was planning to use 3m fireblock sealant and plenty of it. Unless there's another product out there that is better.

I'd still like to hear from someone how much insulation should be used.

 
rjc862003
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Post by rjc862003 » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 7:56 pm

i mean there isn't really a right or wrong amount
that plate might might get to 200F if you got the stove maxed out and directly underneath

two layers of good non-faced r38 would probably more then do the trick

if you are going the hinge route I would install some flat bits of tin to hold the insulation along the edges so it forms a good gasket the tighter you pack it the better the seal or just edge it with tin and good firerope

if you have a flat surface to anchor stuff to the brick you could get creative and make a strike/mounting plate for the rope to set on then 6 or so bolts to hold it up there
Last edited by rjc862003 on Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 7:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

 
franco b
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Post by franco b » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 7:58 pm

fastlane4 wrote:
Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 7:42 pm
I'd still like to hear from someone how much insulation should be used.
Enough so that it is well compressed. Pipe should extend to the tile part of the chimney. If you use a block off plate then fiberglass could be used for large gaps if not well fitted.

Easiest way is to connect pipe to stove with an elbow up chimney to tile part , and then seal the gaps with fiberglass, that is compressed enough to hold well. You can support the elbow with some bricks. Easy to take out for cleaning. A block off plate can be hard to install and take out for cleaning.

 
rjc862003
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Post by rjc862003 » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 8:01 pm

looking closer at the pictures it looks like hes the space and dimensions with the brick to make a bolt on plate

he would need a hammer drill and some concrete anchors but that would be as bullet proof as you could make it

then fire-rope and bobs your uncle
you engineer it right its a couple nuts to get it off and out


 
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Post by rjc862003 » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 8:06 pm

what you would do is build a mounting plate out of simple stamped steel anchor that in with concrete lags or screws and sealant and then bolt your removable or hinged plate to that

or you could just take a piece of tin and sealant and goto town

 
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windyhill4.2
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Post by windyhill4.2 » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 8:08 pm

Anyone else confused yet ??
I understood from the beginning ,that the damper hole was going to be closed off ...

A thimble into the chimney further up is in the plans.

OR, did i mis-understand the originally posted intent ?

 
fastlane4
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Post by fastlane4 » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 8:29 pm

windyhill4.2 wrote:
Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 8:08 pm
Anyone else confused yet ??
I understood from the beginning ,that the damper hole was going to be closed off ...

A thimble into the chimney further up is in the plans.

OR, did i mis-understand the originally posted intent ?
You're right. I was also confused. It's probably my fault for posting the pictures of the block off plate with the pipe in it. That was really the only picture I could find.

My plan is block off plate to completely close the insert opening, then add thimble further up the chimney to install the stove to.

Maybe I don't even need insulation doing it that way? It's been very difficult to get a definitive answer on how to do this.

 
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Post by rjc862003 » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 8:35 pm

you don't NEED insulation its just there to prevent heat from going up and out, as you will loose some though the steel

I believe somebody else also indicated you could just stick the pipe in the hole and pack it goodntight with insulation(use double wall pipe) ( would not advise this but in a pinch ...)


 
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windyhill4.2
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Post by windyhill4.2 » Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 8:48 pm

I doubt that there is a CORRECT amount of insulation to install there,it would be your personal preference as to how much. Maybe think in terms of it being a ceiling & install r30 or higher.

You will likely want to do your thimble install b4 the closure plate so the debris isn't laying on the insulation when it's all done.

 
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Post by ASea » Mon. Dec. 04, 2017 10:57 pm

I ran stoveoioe up into the clay liner and sealed it. I also packed insilation around the pipe. My install is visible as my profile pic

 
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ASea
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Post by ASea » Mon. Dec. 04, 2017 10:58 pm

I ran stove pipe up into the clay liner and sealed it. I also packed insulation around the pipe. My install is visible as my profile pic.I have excellent draft.

 
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Post by rjc862003 » Mon. Dec. 04, 2017 11:10 pm

to small can't see

 
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michaelanthony
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Post by michaelanthony » Wed. Dec. 06, 2017 8:26 am

fastlane4 wrote:
Sun. Nov. 05, 2017 8:29 pm
.......................................................................................................

My plan is block off plate to completely close the insert opening, then add thimble further up the chimney to install the stove to.

Maybe I don't even need insulation doing it that way? It's been very difficult to get a definitive answer on how to do this.
You can block the entire damper or partial if you like. My living room fireplace is blocked off with cement board. I removed the damper louver and left the damper frame intact. I cut 2 pieces of cement board a couple inches wider than the frame and put them on top of the frame weighted down with a couple of old fire bricks leaving an almost round hole in the center for the stove pipe to go through. I sealed it the edges of the 2 pieces with fire stop and fiberglass insulation around the pipe. going on 5 yrs with out a hitch and 20 dollars spent. The picture is one side of the pipe and you can see the outline of the damper frame against the grey cement board. The fiberglass allows for easy removal of the pipe if needed. ;)

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