Coalpail.com Forum

I had a dealer offer me a new Harman Magnum Stoker (without the trim and tiles) for $2400 today. He claimed his normal retail was $3200 (or something like that - definitely well about $3000). So, as usual, I have some questions -

If you are using the stove, do you like it? Pluses and minuses? How noisy is the blower?

Is it a good price? I'm not sure what the delivery/set up would cost. I have the chimney so I'm guessing it would just take swapping the current stove and possibly enlarging the pad some.

My one concern is (and this is for the LL Pioneer as well) is the availability of rice coal where I live in Hunterdon Cty, NJ. I'd probably need to rent a truck/trailer to come to NePa for it in the late summer. My other concern is (and again, this would cover the LL Pioneer too) is power outage. The Harman dealer mentioned a battery backup but for the price, I think it would be more wise to buy a small generator to run the stove, sump, and fridge. This concern has led me to look at gravity fed units as well. Any suggestions in this area?

While that is a very good price for a Harman Mag stoker, it still is more than a LL pioneer.. and the LL Pioneer comes with a Coal Trol automated thermostat... Maybe the thermostat is not a plus for you, but most people like them...

The price on the Harman is very attractive, definitely a good deal for a new stove, but if you are price shopping, lots of stoves come on the market used in very good condition, at a better price.

Greg L

.

So you're thinking the LL Pioneer is still a better buy? It's only about $200 difference though I understand what you say about the coal-trol. Does the Harman not have that kind of temperature control?

tvb wrote:....Does the Harman not have that kind of temperature control?

The Harman controls the temp via a Tstat and relay timer box, the convection fan is wither on or off, the stoker motor is either on or off and the Combustion blower runs only when the stoker motor runs. When the Tstat calls for heat the stove runs at full blast till the Tstat says it is satisfied. Set up of the Harman involves setting the stoker stroke to keep the fire on the grate when running continuously to satisfy the Tstat calling for heat, when not calling for heat the timer runs the stove in pilot mode based on user setting to keep a minimum fire on the grate. Frequent adjustments can be needed to match different conditions and coal quality.

The Coal_Trol on the other hand runs the combustion fan continuously, the stoker motor runs a percentage of the time based on a calculation that checks to see where the actual Vs set point of the Tstat are, and the convection fan runs variable speed from dead stop to full speed also based on Tstat set point Vs actual room temp. When the Tstat calls for heat the unit slowly ramps up heat output by way of fan speed and stoker feed rate till satisfied then it ramps down. To set the Coal-trol up set the stoker stroke to max feed (or some setting to get a good amount of coal), set min and max fire settings with the push of a button while observing the fire and then simply set what ever temp you like, no further setting changes required except for occasional differences in coal quality.

I have run a Harman with both the Coal-Trol and the Harman control, my vote is Coal-Trol. Once you set it up there is very little change required if any. The other benefit is a room temp within 1*F of set point 99.9% of the time. Room temps with the Harman control can vary as much as 5*F depending on settings and conditions.

Not sure if this barrage helped, but it is based on personal experience, so take it for what it's worrth.

No the Harman does not have anywhere near the automation for controling temperature. You can use a Coal Trol with a Harman if you wish though.

The Coal trol unit controls the fan speeds. the stoker speed and usually can control the room temperature to within one degree. The Harman controls are for feed and time of feed. Not anywhere near as sophisticated or automated.. that said, some folks don't like comute automation, so the Coal Trol is not attractive. But most who use it like it.

the Harman is a very good stove, there is absolutely Nothing wrong with it. But if you look in the 'for sale' listings at the bottom of the home page there is a Harman Mag stoker available for much less... and Harman products are very well made, and not subject to issues with age and use.

Greg L.

.

I see Matthaus was faster on the keyboard than I was..

greg L

.

LsFarm wrote:I see Matthaus was faster on the keyboard than I was..

Yeah but I don't have as comfortable a chair.

The Harman is a great unit you wouldn't regret buying

I have been using mine all season and the more I have learned about the other stoves on the market the more I'm glad I got a Harman, the little things that I didn't think would be important are important

There are several threads you need to read here in the forum

Cleaning Glass/Stove

Stove With Coal-Trol Won't Shut Off?

Convection Fan Issues With Leisure Line Econo Line Stove

LL Pocono Blower Fans?? Run on High All the Time?

Thermostat Overshoot on a LL Pioneer Controlled by the Coal-trol

Post by tmiraglia - Purchasing a Stove - Anyone Burn the "Lehigh"?

Harman History Video

There are more posts that relate to the choices you can make.

I'm not going to condemn a certain stove, control, or manufacturer but there are things to consider, and when someone recommends one brand over another take a look over on the right and see what they are using

Sometimes it gets to be POPULAR to recommend something .

Your best to stick to the facts like buying a car don't be swayed by pitch look at

• Quality
• Materials
• Workmanship
• Time in the Industry
• Warranty

Great information from all - lots to consider and think about. I'm glad I'm making the buying foray on my own schedule (versus needing a stove right now and yesterday) so that I can consider all the factors you coal veterans put out there. One other factor is the Harman dealer is just down the road (when I went there before and received unsatisfactory information it was due to the owner being out on sick leave as I learned from him today). LL on the other hand is 100 miles away and while I know the support would be excellent via email and phone, there's alot to be said for calling someone up and having them over in a day or two in case of a problem.

Coalstoves, I'll spend time reading the links tomorrow. Thanks for doing that research for those conversations.

I hope the info helps it wasn't much work we have lots'a posts on comparison and favorite brands so read on and don't take that little photo play as disrespect fer yer question I got some heat in the past for my views and those who know might get a chuckle from it.

Any help feel free to ask .

I bought a Harman Magnum 3 years ago and I've been pretty pleased with it. I bought new b/c it was fall and at the time oil prices SKYROCKETED so finding a used stoker stove was almost impossible. That said, these stoves seem bullet proof. I don't see what can go wrong with my Magnum. (matthaus could tell us if he sees any weak points. He dissects a new stove every week )

One thing on setup. You MUST have a barometric damper with the Magnum. I didn't instalol one for the first 1.5 years and when it got colder out (more draft in the chimney), the colder my stove got Well it turn out without a baro all the heat was getting sucked right up the chimney

My father had a Harman DVC-500 and didn't use one, so I figured I didn't need one either [I'm an idiot].

That said, don't be afraid to buy used. But search the forum or post the question what to look for in a used stoker. The coal experts hear will be able to tell you what to look for.

Coal availability issue

If you have a Harman dealer right down the road, doesn't he sell coal?

tvb wrote: My one concern is (and this is for the LL Pioneer as well) is the availability of rice coal where I live in Hunterdon Cty, NJ. I'd probably need to rent a truck/trailer to come to NePa for it in the late summer. My other concern is (and again, this would cover the LL Pioneer too) is power outage. The Harman dealer mentioned a battery backup but for the price, I think it would be more wise to buy a small generator to run the stove, sump, and fridge. This concern has led me to look at gravity fed units as well. Any suggestions in this area?

From Flemington the ride is not that bad to coal country, and a trip for the good stuff is a fun day (in my opinion) and worthwhile if you're using coal as your primary heat source.
Harman stove are top notch, very well made, but with Leisure Line it's much easier to talk to the "source".
Take your time and learn about the different stoves available before spending your hard-earned money.

From Flemington the ride is not that bad to coal country, and a trip for the good stuff is a fun day

Eh, the trailer is already rented. It may be my excuse to pick an old pickup truck to use for hauling stuff around.

One thing on setup. You MUST have a barometric damper with the Magnum. I didn't instalol one for the first 1.5 years and when it got colder out (more draft in the chimney), the colder my stove got Well it turn out without a baro all the heat was getting sucked right up the chimney

I just purchased one on EBay yesterday as the same thing happened to me last week with the very ancient Vermont Castings Vigilant I am muddling by on. I'm looking forward to installing it and of course, it will also be easier for me to convince myself to get a new stove sooner rather than later.

Tvb, please do read the threads Coalstoves listed. Also use the search functions here to find other useful threads. But please read through the entirety of the threads that you start reading. A number of the threads Coalstoves linked to start off with concerns about the Coal-trol Digital product by new owners and ended up with positive resolutions in the closing posts of the threads.

Customer service forum threads are started on the basis of a perceived problem. Like a great many customer service calls the problem often turns out to be either a misunderstanding or minor setup problem that can be readily worked out over the phone. However, unlike most service calls, customer service threads on a forum are open to all to see and for all to contribute to. This can be a great benefit to pro-active customers who like to seek out answers before making a phone call or making a purchase decision, and to the internet friendly companies that participate, but it can also be a problem. If these threads are only skimmed or only the first few posts are read it can create a misleading impression. Thankfully we have a knowledgeable and supportive customer base here on the NEPA forums so we don't have the common problem of public forums that are filled primarily with posts about problems and complaints.

Just read through to make sure you're getting the whole picture, not just the initial stages of what can be a "messy" process of helping customers troubleshoot and resolve the issues that they encounter. And as always, feel free to post any questions you come up with on these forums, or contact us at Automation Correct directly (PM or phone, website link provided below) with any questions about the Coal-trol that you may have. Jerry and Karen from Leisure Line Stoves are active here and very receptive to direct questions. EFM has a rep on these forums, too.