Back up Solar Panels for a Coal Stove.

funstuff · Post by **funstuff** » Fri. Jan. 18, 2008 1:15 am

Has any one thought to figure out how many KW would need to be produced via solar panels with batteries for running these coal stoves during power outages? Or just for an increased savings in your overall electric use.
I am thinking of looking into it.I have a 12 kw back up system that runs of my 45hp tractor PTO. So I can keep my home going and my stove. Still have to buy diesel fuel for it.
Still it seems like it would not take much power at all to go solar with these coal stoves. I suppose these small fans on theses stoves run under 5 amps.
I want to install a 1500 KWH PV system in my home. I am just waiting for that extra 45K to come in to do it and waiting for the gov to offer big rebates like in CA. MD has a 4K rebate on any PV system and 3k on any solar hot water system.

Anyhow. If I could design a system for under $1000 bucks. Would any one be the slightest bit interested in trying it? Not trying to sell anything. Just seeing if there would be an interest in such a thing.

JiminBucks · Post by **JiminBucks** » Fri. Jan. 18, 2008 1:29 am

I think it would be alot easier and cheaper to just buy a handfired stove that doesn't need juice as a backup, or get a couple of deep cycle batteries and keep them on a trickle charger!

funstuff · Post by **funstuff** » Fri. Jan. 18, 2008 9:32 am

That’s a good idea for power outages. However batteries are DC and most stoves are AC current. I suppose DC motors could be bought for the stoves. A solar panel system would do the same thing as a trickle charger. During the day the stove would run off of the panel. After peak sunshine it would run off the batteries. A 200w panel runs around 800-$1000.

av8r · Post by **av8r** » Fri. Jan. 18, 2008 9:48 am

funstuff wrote:That’s a good idea for power outages. However batteries are DC and most stoves are AC current. I suppose DC motors could be bought for the stoves. A solar panel system would do the same thing as a trickle charger. During the day the stove would run off of the panel. After peak sunshine it would run off the batteries. A 200w panel runs around 800-$1000.

You use the deep cycle batts to power an inverter which, as you know, converts DC to AC.

flame · Post by **flame** » Fri. Jan. 18, 2008 12:54 pm

Solar does look very attractive. But, can be very expensive with a very long payback. The good thing is the life expectancy of solar panel is about 20 to 25 years. A small system to run the stove will set you back at least $1500. A couple of solar panels, charge controller, inverter and a couple of batteries.

The kicker about solar is the time of year you need the most power (duration) is the time of least amount of sunlight. This is a realization I had with our installation in Mexico. I have an off the grid system with a 3.2kw solar array, 1 kw wind turbine and a 21kw diesel generator, 6 kw inverter and 16 batteries. Down there, no real choice if I wanted electric. Cost works out to about 0.20 per kilowatt hour - compare that to your local electric company rate. It would be nice if states would rebate 50% of the cost - brings in more in line. Funstuff - got the price about right.

What is interesting is the Plain Folk (amish) have taken a real shine (pun intended) to solar power. Some vendors are now designing small systems for charging batteries. The batteries for their buggy lights and the Black and Decker hand power tools (and their cell phones).

In any case it may be more cost effective to have a simple backup generator and transfer switch. Or what I do up here - pull out my 1kw Honda "lunch box" generator and plug in the Harman Stoker.

sandman · Post by **sandman** » Fri. Jan. 18, 2008 5:05 pm

as I posted some where else here, it would take a lot of solar.

the hot set up would be converting the stove to 12v dc motors and fans. I will more than likely do this some time in the future.

i have a camp off the grid with a little more than 1500w of panels.

if I wanted to run my stoker 24-7 my best guess is i'd have to add another 1500w or so.

remember solar is only making power for around 5hrs a day this time of the year.

when the sun is shining

funstuff · Post by **funstuff** » Sat. Jan. 19, 2008 1:58 am

Good thoughts indeed. It is pretty easy just to hook up my 12kw generator and I like you have a small generater that could be used to run the stove during an outage. I guess I am just dreaming. Sure would be nice not to get those electric bills every month. Or better yet. Have them send you a check for the power put back on the grid via a grid tied PV system.

I agree sandman. Getting DC motors would be the way to go. I like these DC relief attic fans they make with a solar panel to run them. I need three of them in my home so that would be $1500 bucks with me installing them. What a shame the stuff is so costly.

LsFarm · Post by **LsFarm** » Sat. Jan. 19, 2008 9:41 am

ON the Cheap: [which will pay back the soonest]
Find a UPS on Ebay, 1500w + they sell cheap when the batteries go bad
Install Marine Deep cycle batteries to the UPS
Use some solar panels to keep the batteries charged if you want.
When/if the power goes out, your stoker doesn't
Use your generator as needed to recharge the batteries

This won't replace online electric power, but will provide backup power, and if
you used the stored power in the UPS batteries every week or so, and recharged
them only with solar panels you would get some savings.

Greg L

spc · Post by **spc** » Sat. Jan. 19, 2008 9:51 am

How many watts does a stoker use, say a LL pioneer? I have an APC SMART-UPS 1500 & was wondering if it could cut it with an external deep cycle battery.

sandman · Post by **sandman** » Sat. Jan. 19, 2008 11:44 am

LsFarm wrote:ON the Cheap: [which will pay back the soonest]
Find a UPS on Ebay, 1500w + they sell cheap when the batteries go bad
Install Marine Deep cycle batteries to the UPS
Use some solar panels to keep the batteries charged if you want.
When/if the power goes out, your stoker doesn't
Use your generator as needed to recharge the batteries

This won't replace online electric power, but will provide backup power, and if
you used the stored power in the UPS batteries every week or so, and recharged
them only with solar panels you would get some savings.

Greg L

that will work great. you don't even worry about the batteries fitting in the ups you mount them in a battery box.

a couple of 8d's will run your stoker for a while

that and a honda 2k gen/inverter and your good to go

sandman · Post by **sandman** » Sat. Jan. 19, 2008 11:49 am

spc wrote:How many watts does a stoker use, say a LL pioneer? I have an APC SMART-UPS 1500 & was wondering if it could cut it with an external deep cycle battery.

the ups should run it fine, if you want it to last get several big batteries like 8d's

as too how many watts it uses you'd need to get a kill a watt meter and plug your stoker in and let it run.

you can even see how much eack part of the stove draws.

jim

funstuff · Post by **funstuff** » Mon. Jan. 21, 2008 6:43 pm

I think amps divided by voltage might give you your watts.

gambler · Post by **gambler** » Mon. Jan. 21, 2008 6:47 pm

I believe it is volts x amps = watts.

Charlie Z · Post by **Charlie Z** » Mon. Jan. 21, 2008 7:52 pm

flame wrote:...Cost works out to about 0.20 per kilowatt hour - compare that to your local electric company rate...

That's 1.3 cents cheaper than we pay here on long island for juice...

av8r · Post by **av8r** » Mon. Jan. 21, 2008 9:00 pm

spc wrote:How many watts does a stoker use, say a LL pioneer? I have an APC SMART-UPS 1500 & was wondering if it could cut it with an external deep cycle battery.

Ran my Hearth for over 4 hours on a APC 1400. Had over 70% capacity left (if you believe the LEDs)