New use for old Coal Mines
"The system is capable of generating up to 20 MW of power in shafts varying from 500 feet to 5,000 feet. It can last 50 years without degradation, and it’s cost-effective because it uses existing infrastructure."
http://www.digitaljournal.com/tech-and-science/te ... 0Weekender
This is an excellent reuse of something already in place that could be repurposed for another use and has
new life for many years to come.
BigBarney
http://www.digitaljournal.com/tech-and-science/te ... 0Weekender
This is an excellent reuse of something already in place that could be repurposed for another use and has
new life for many years to come.
BigBarney
- freetown fred
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Unfortunatly B, just like wind & solar--lots & lots of money could be spent on this concept & the only ones making anything will be politicians, contractors & the companies creating the concept.
- windyhill4.2
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BB, how on earth can you fall for this worthless trash ideas...??
Perpetual motion fads have been around for many yrs.
Now this fund raising/a few people get rich/company goes bankrupt/freaking plan fades into oblivion ....
So i am supposed to fall for the idea that dropping 3000 tons down a deep hole will generate enough electric to help run a region + have enough electrical power left to raise the 3000 tons to the top so this perpetual motion can run another cycle ...
I don't need a college edification to see the money trail on this idea.
Perpetual motion fads have been around for many yrs.
Now this fund raising/a few people get rich/company goes bankrupt/freaking plan fades into oblivion ....
So i am supposed to fall for the idea that dropping 3000 tons down a deep hole will generate enough electric to help run a region + have enough electrical power left to raise the 3000 tons to the top so this perpetual motion can run another cycle ...
I don't need a college edification to see the money trail on this idea.
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Well it is more of a storage device...
It is designed like a battery but uses physics instead of chemicals...
To store energy for peak demand...
Used instead of gas turbine peak load generators...
Problem is not too many mine shafts close to large power demands...
Energy is lost in long transmission routes...
Best I have seen is the hi-tech flywheel...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flywheel_energy_storage
It is designed like a battery but uses physics instead of chemicals...
To store energy for peak demand...
Used instead of gas turbine peak load generators...
Problem is not too many mine shafts close to large power demands...
Energy is lost in long transmission routes...
Best I have seen is the hi-tech flywheel...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flywheel_energy_storage
- windyhill4.2
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There is far cheaper & more abundant energy stored in cow shyt in thousands of tanks & pits across this country.
Capecoaler has the right idea , just like a battery , to act as a buffer in
the grid to absorb energy as power demand falls off , by raising the weight,
and release the stored energy at peak demand. These peaking rates are much
higher than base line rates which make it economical. Buy cheap off peak excess
electric and sell back for 10- 20 times the regular rate. Simple to do.
BigBarney
the grid to absorb energy as power demand falls off , by raising the weight,
and release the stored energy at peak demand. These peaking rates are much
higher than base line rates which make it economical. Buy cheap off peak excess
electric and sell back for 10- 20 times the regular rate. Simple to do.
BigBarney
Especially if they pay you to take the mine off their hands.
This is a long life setup 50+ years and very low maintenance.
The pay back on peaking electricity is very fast at the high price
of summer , air conditioning loads.
http://www.pjm.com/about-pjm/learning-center/pric ... icker.aspx
Power @ $ 25 MWh now has gone to over $ 120+ in the summer
peak. Night rate now $17 so even selling into the grid now
gets a profit of $ 8 MWh not too shabby.
Summer time rates...
https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/update/ar ... arkets.php
BigBarney
This is a long life setup 50+ years and very low maintenance.
The pay back on peaking electricity is very fast at the high price
of summer , air conditioning loads.
http://www.pjm.com/about-pjm/learning-center/pric ... icker.aspx
Power @ $ 25 MWh now has gone to over $ 120+ in the summer
peak. Night rate now $17 so even selling into the grid now
gets a profit of $ 8 MWh not too shabby.
Summer time rates...
https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/update/ar ... arkets.php
BigBarney
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Years ago water was, and I think still is, pumped up from the Hudson river to a reservoir on the bluff overlooking the river during low power demand, and then used to power generators during high demand.
Look at Kinzua pumped storage in Warren County PA..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seneca_Pumped_Stora ... ng_Station
450MWh storage with pumping up at night and release to peak demand.
BigBarney
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seneca_Pumped_Stora ... ng_Station
450MWh storage with pumping up at night and release to peak demand.
BigBarney
I almost forgot to add the Robert Moses Power Station at Niagara Fall's
NY and Niagara Fall's ON that has been doing this same thing for over
50 years with pumped storage and using the excess power at night.
They only let a limited amount of water over the Falls in the night
hours. They have over 3 million horsepower available.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Moses_Niagar ... ower_Plant
BigBarney
NY and Niagara Fall's ON that has been doing this same thing for over
50 years with pumped storage and using the excess power at night.
They only let a limited amount of water over the Falls in the night
hours. They have over 3 million horsepower available.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Moses_Niagar ... ower_Plant
BigBarney
- freetown fred
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B, 3 million isn't squat bein we supply NYC & God knows who else!
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Fred I think the point is not the size of that plant, but rather that the private sector has found it worthwhile on its own to invest in this type of energy storage, with similar systems now used in many places. I agree the jury is out on the mineshaft thing, but it seems plausible that there may be places where it would work.
Mike
Mike
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Instead of using a deep shaft put it in a circle and it's called a flywheel. Now you can keep the mine for coal production and put the wheel in a tiny shed. My Listers have flywheels and can start large inductive loads.