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ByrnesvilleMurphy
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Post by ByrnesvilleMurphy » Mon. Sep. 18, 2017 11:32 pm

Hi All! My name is Murph and I hail from Schuylkill County, Pa. After several days of surfing thru the forums and various threads of this well established site, I decided to join. From what I viewed, all of the contributing members and Mods are very experienced and well informed in coal heat. That in itself helped me a lot and probably MANY more people who just surf by without stopping by.

I have some experience in coal heat. When I was a youngster I used to watch my uncle operate a large coal stove, which heated a 2000+ sqft house. Before long, I learned to load, stoke, rake, and.... empty that massive beast. That's going back 35-40 years. Between then, I've been using either oil or electric as a source of heat :no1:

So, for the last year (or so) I was considering an alternate to electric baseboard heat. I thought about propane gas for a fireplace but quickly realized it was not much different from the electric expense. Then recently, I thought about a wood stove which I was really looking into and excited about, then I thought about where I could keep 3-5 cords (or transporting a single cord). Then it kicked in! If I were to get a stove, why not get a coal stove?

That's where I'm at now. A coal stove makes the most logical sense living in a coal region where its cheaper, clean, and available. The problem I am facing is: If I'm going to do it, I need to do it right. This part is critical since it has been 30 years since I dealt with coal.

I know there's so many topics here about different stoves/stokers and installs but I was wondering if anyone reading this will share some experience or pointers for my consideration moving forward in my purchase and install.

95 yr old 1500 sq ft 2 1/2 story wood frame (twin/ half-double) with basement

I'm looking for any input between Keystoker, Hitzer or Reading (or any others) gravity fed stoves 90k BTU range as primary heat. And is it OK to horizontal direct vent? Any info you provide will be greatly appreciated!

Thank you all for reading my post. - Murph


 
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McGiever
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Post by McGiever » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 12:50 am

As you have surmised. you came to the right place. And we Welcome You! :)

I'm not your guy for the questions at hand but rest assured someone will be along with some Great Insights to what you are looking for.

You came to the right place. ;)

 
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davidmcbeth3
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Post by davidmcbeth3 » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 4:05 am

Where would you like a stove OP?

Many choices ... 1st place to start.

 
franco b
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Post by franco b » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 8:36 am

The heating system starts with the chimney. Keep in mind that a direct or power vent, installed with appropriate stoker, has to run 24 hours, seven days a week, with consequent shortened life. A chimney is much to be preferred if at all possible.

 
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Sunny Boy
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Post by Sunny Boy » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 11:36 am

Welcome Murphy.

Lots of questions still needing answers. But, as Franco said it's best to start with the chimney .

A. Does your house have a chimney now ?
B. If yes, then what kind of chimney, in what condition ?
C. How high is it from ground level ?
D. Where is it located in relation to prevailing winds and the house roof ?

Once you get answers to those questions, then you can think about where you want the stove to be. Such as living room, family room, or basement ? To further refine that, figure out where is the best place to put the stove to heat the most of the house using natural convection, therefore, needing the least amount of electricity to move the heat around the house.

And as far as electricity needs, what are the chances of power outages in your area during cold weather ? In other words do you need a stove that can still put out the same heat during a power outage ? Some modern stoves need a fan going to get to their rated heat output.

Would you prefer a modern, or an antique stove ?

Answers to those questions will help us help you narrow down stove choices.

Paul

 
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Post by Pacowy » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 11:56 am

With a 2 1/2 story house I would be a little concerned about distributing the "primary heat" from a single stove location. Might that be an issue here? Many address this by using coal-powered central heat, and at least some by using multiple stoves.

Mike

 
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coaledsweat
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Post by coaledsweat » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 12:06 pm

So you currently only have electric heat? No other heating system in place at this time?


 
ByrnesvilleMurphy
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Post by ByrnesvilleMurphy » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 3:05 pm

Thank you McGiever and Sunny Boy for the welcoming! And everyone else with their prompt responses!!!

Oh boy, I am a little more confused. I didn't know that the power direct vent needs to run 24/7/365. And my house only has remnants of what must have been a chimney on the South side. It's boxed in the basement and runs up thru the first floor between the open dining and living room, but I don't see anything on the second floor, and then in the attic it is present again, but it does not exit the roof. So, at one time there was one but it has been removed? There's evidence that there was a coal stoker at one time because I still have a coal door on my porch which leads to the basement.

Yes, currently I have electric baseboard throughout with an unheated attic. I had the impression I could purchase a coal stove which I could place in the corner of my dining room on a nice tile hearth. And perhaps run the exhaust horizontally thru the exterior wall. However, I did not know this setup would require year round operation and a shortened lifespan.

I can't remember the last time we lost power during a storm other than Sandy and that was only 15 mins. And I can't recall any winter outages in the last 30 years or so.

Can I run a hand fed stove without using a chimney? Thank you all for your help! -Murph

 
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coaledsweat
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Post by coaledsweat » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 3:26 pm

The DV only has to run when you have a fire going and need heat, it is what keeps the fire alive if you do not have a chimney. I doubt that would be 365 days unless you are near the Arctic circle.

 
franco b
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Post by franco b » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 3:39 pm

ByrnesvilleMurphy wrote:Can I run a hand fed stove without using a chimney? Thank you all for your help! -Murph
No you can't. The reason a flat bed stoker can be run that way is because in the event of power failure it soon goes out. Not so, a hand fed stove which will burn for many hours. The power vent only needs to run when there is fire in the stoker. Presumably it will be shut down in summer.

From the first floor (dining room) perhaps you could go through the wall into a metal chimney running up the side of the house.

 
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northernmainecoal
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Post by northernmainecoal » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 3:48 pm

sounds to me like the brick chimney is all there except for above the roof line. skip the metal pipe and top of that old chimney with brick, it will last forever. if there is evidence of the brick chimney on the first floor and in the attic I have to assume it's there on the second floor as well

 
ByrnesvilleMurphy
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Post by ByrnesvilleMurphy » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 4:39 pm

You guys are very helpful! So I have a good understanding, a metal chimney is a pipe from the stove that goes thru the exterior wall and runs vertically up the side of the house above the roof line, correct? And the direct vent (or powered direct vent) is running from the stove, thru the wall and stopping horizontally on the other side (of siding) with no vertical run? Northermaincoal, you are correct. I was able to locate the second floor chimney run. However, it does not protrude the roof.

 
ByrnesvilleMurphy
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Post by ByrnesvilleMurphy » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 4:53 pm

Would it be more economical to run the exhaust thru the wall with a blower? Do I need to run a metal chimney above the roof line. The existing chimney is an option, but I would need to finish it and have any necessary repairs done to the liner. Thanks again! I promise to stop bugging you all with the million questions :D

 
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Sunny Boy
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Post by Sunny Boy » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 5:02 pm

ByrnesvilleMurphy wrote:You guys are very helpful! So I have a good understanding, a metal chimney is a pipe from the stove that goes thru the exterior wall and runs vertically up the side of the house above the roof line, correct? And the direct vent (or powered direct vent) is running from the stove, thru the wall and stopping horizontally on the other side (of siding) with no vertical run? Northermaincoal, you are correct. I was able to locate the second floor chimney run. However, it does not protrude the roof.
Yes, a metal chimney is all metal. And it has to be at least two feet higher than a line extending from the pipe ten feet horizontally to the neatest part of the roof. It only needs to be single wall indoors, unless it's close to combustibles, but needs a special double walled pipe outdoors to help keep heat in the pipe to maintain draft strength. And Stainless Steel stove pipes don't get along well with coal fly ash. And it's expensive.

Considering what a metal pipe would cost for maybe a shorter life span, it may be worth it to get an estimate to inspect and see about re-extending the top of your brick chimney through the roof line. A brick chimney will last many life times with coal. Since it's an inside chimney the draft will be very good and I assume it extends into the basement. If it does, you could add a coal stove in the basement, if you find you need to.

Paul

 
franco b
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Post by franco b » Tue. Sep. 19, 2017 5:33 pm

Yes, what Paul recommends is best, and might very well be cheaper. Both power vent and insulated metal chimneys are expensive.

That inside chimney will also contribute to heating any room it passes through. There is also the option of using many stoves, both used and antique which could save money over new. So get it inspected by someone knowledgeable. You might inquire at a local mason supply for a recommendation.


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