SS Chimney Liners

General energy and coal related topics, news and basic information. If you do not know where to post your topic post it here.
User avatar
SMITTY
Member
Posts: 11915
Joined: Sun. Dec. 11, 2005 12:43 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Patriot Coal - (custom built by Jim Dorsey, Taunton MA - RIP 4/18/13)
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III (SOLD!)
Coal Size/Type: Rice / Blaschak anthracite
Other Heating: Oil fired Burnham boiler
Location: West-Central Mass

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 9:38 am

michaelanthony wrote:I'm waiting for SMITTY to post his chimney pic's.....................smelling salts please! :stretcher:

I Dare an inspector to step on his compound!
:mrgreen:
The laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are
neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. ...Such laws make things worse
for the assaulted and better for the assailants, they serve rather to
encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with
greater confidence than an armed man."

- Thomas Jefferson, quoting 18th century criminologist Cesare Beccaria in "On
Crimes and Punishment."


User avatar
scalabro
Member
Posts: 2808
Joined: Wed. Oct. 03, 2012 9:53 am
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40's, PP Stewart No. 14, Abendroth Bros "Record 40"
Coal Size/Type: Stove / Anthracite.
Other Heating: Oil fired, forced hot air.
Location: Southwick Massachusetts

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 9:49 am

No sense in this anymore...I did what I thought I should do that was best for my setup.

Who can tell me different if they have not operated my setup?

No one.

I've posted that yes, properly sized masonry chimneys are the best.

I've posted I tried mine and it did not draft correctly.

It's WAY TOO BIG.

I've posted I have an AL29 liner.

I've posted that the inspector would not sign off the permit unless it had a SS liner.

I WILL get at least ten years out of it through correct operation and maintenance.

I've posted I have a 100 year old mild steel ashpan that is in great shape.

Some of us have to have a SS liner for various reasons. All I ask is that folk's who ask here don't get the same old tired response that a SS liner is a waste or that it WILL kill you. They aren't and won't when used with respect.

You know what? If you are an idiot and never have your chimney swept of course it won't last more than a few years, duh!

Continue to bash, I'm secure in my chimney!
Last edited by scalabro on Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

CapeCoaler
Member
Posts: 4428
Joined: Sun. Feb. 10, 2008 3:48 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: want AA130
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine BS#4, Harman MKII, Hitzer 503,...
Coal Size/Type: Pea/Nut/Stove
Location: Cape Cod, MA

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 9:54 am

I installed an insulated SS liner on the 'rents 503...
Outside north facin' chimney that had never worked well with the fireplace...
Large flue center, oil left, basement stove right...
Oil is marginal and they leave the stack temps 8* higher to make it work...
The insert did not work just dumping into the existing flue no liner...
Once the 6" insulated liner went in the stove was perfect...
The liner has been in 7 years now and has developed pinholes...
We live in a maritime enviroment, Cape Cod, so the moisture is there no matter what...
The free replacement liner would be great but its the labor that is the killer...
Good thing I 'know people'... ;)
Masonry inside the house would be better but that is not what the builder built...
They made it pretty...
I am not an engineer, train or otherwise!
I stay at a Holiday Inn at least once a year!
Most of all I do have common sense and a practical application of logic.
Oh, add humor, on the dry side, along with a wee bit 'o sarcasm.

User avatar
freetown fred
Member
Posts: 21412
Joined: Thu. Dec. 31, 2009 12:33 pm
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut
Location: Freetown,NY 13803

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 9:55 am

Calm down Gekko ;) I don't read in here a soul that was bashing YOUR set-up--the topic was about JF planning a NEW possible job with an insert & some suggestions about it. PS---CC, the point is, you tried things before going with the SS liner, that's all that I've been suggesting here-- If that insert had of drawn well, I'm sure you would of stuck with just the masonry. PS--masonry is best inside or out!
"A people that values it's privileges above it's principals, soon loses both"--Dwight D Eisenhower

User avatar
Fire375
Member
Posts: 47
Joined: Wed. Dec. 03, 2008 9:31 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: Hitzer Stoker
Stove/Furnace Model: 710
Location: Indiana

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 10:07 am

freetown fred wrote:And you know this how??? I'd also like to see anywhere in your National Code--which is what we all go by--that mandates SS liners anywhere??
NFPA 211 requires all inserts to be installed with a chimney connector pipe (stainless steel or the equivalent) from the insert and a up a minimum into the first clay flue liner.

Maximum flue size is limited. NFPA 211-00 and IRC-06,-03,-00 requires that the fireplace chimney be no larger than 3 times the cross-sectional area of the appliance flue collar. Flues larger than the maximum allowed size must be relined.

An Interior chimney max size is 3 times the flue collar area.
Max size for an exterior (one or more walls of chimney below the roofline exposed to the outside) is 2 times the flue collar area

User avatar
scalabro
Member
Posts: 2808
Joined: Wed. Oct. 03, 2012 9:53 am
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40's, PP Stewart No. 14, Abendroth Bros "Record 40"
Coal Size/Type: Stove / Anthracite.
Other Heating: Oil fired, forced hot air.
Location: Southwick Massachusetts

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 10:25 am

Fire375 wrote:
freetown fred wrote:And you know this how??? I'd also like to see anywhere in your National Code--which is what we all go by--that mandates SS liners anywhere??
NFPA 211 requires all inserts to be installed with a chimney connector pipe (stainless steel or the equivalent) from the insert and a up a minimum into the first clay flue liner.

Maximum flue size is limited. NFPA 211-00 and IRC-06,-03,-00 requires that the fireplace chimney be no larger than 3 times the cross-sectional area of the appliance flue collar. Flues larger than the maximum allowed size must be relined.

An Interior chimney max size is 3 times the flue collar area.
Max size for an exterior (one or more walls of chimney below the roofline exposed to the outside) is 2 times the flue collar area
And there you go.

User avatar
scalabro
Member
Posts: 2808
Joined: Wed. Oct. 03, 2012 9:53 am
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40's, PP Stewart No. 14, Abendroth Bros "Record 40"
Coal Size/Type: Stove / Anthracite.
Other Heating: Oil fired, forced hot air.
Location: Southwick Massachusetts

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 10:56 am

freetown fred wrote:Calm down Gekko ;) I don't read in here a soul that was bashing YOUR set-up--the topic was about JF planning a NEW possible job with an insert & some suggestions about it. PS---CC, the point is, you tried things before going with the SS liner, that's all that I've been suggesting here-- If that insert had of drawn well, I'm sure you would of stuck with just the masonry. PS--masonry is best inside or out!
Um ...... Please go back and re read your first post in this thread.

I believe you said I got "taken"

User avatar
freetown fred
Member
Posts: 21412
Joined: Thu. Dec. 31, 2009 12:33 pm
Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut
Location: Freetown,NY 13803

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 11:07 am

Hell gecko, that wasn't bashing, that was just a fact. National code states ya gotta have black or SS pipe up to clay tile--any chimneys I've done start the clay tile just above the smoke shelf--maybe 4 ft or so of pipe--no argument there
Gekko wrote:
freetown fred wrote:Calm down Gekko ;) I don't read in here a soul that was bashing YOUR set-up--the topic was about JF planning a NEW possible job with an insert & some suggestions about it. PS---CC, the point is, you tried things before going with the SS liner, that's all that I've been suggesting here-- If that insert had of drawn well, I'm sure you would of stuck with just the masonry. PS--masonry is best inside or out!
Um ...... Please go back and re read your first post in this thread.

I believe you said I got "taken"
"A people that values it's privileges above it's principals, soon loses both"--Dwight D Eisenhower


User avatar
titleist1
Member
Posts: 4404
Joined: Wed. Nov. 14, 2007 4:06 pm
Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Harman Mag Stoker (old style) one in basement, one in workshop
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Harman Mark III on standby for long power outages
Coal Size/Type: Rice/Anthracite; Nut/Anthracite
Location: Cecil County, MD

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 11:24 am

If the masonry chimney can't be used, would it be a better investment to put in a insulated double wall SS chimney in the large flue rather than a flexible single wall liner? Maybe the projected lifespan out weighs the cost difference?

I am in the 1% (don't picket me! :P ) since I've had the same SS double wall insulated chimney since Jan of 1993. It's still solid and it's on the shaded north side of the house. I do make sure to brush it out good after burn season is done and I take off the cap at the bottom while sealing the thimble on the inside. My theory was it allows air flow through it and keeps it drier, seems to have worked for here. Maybe sealing it top and bottom on a very low humidity day would work better for some locations. I check it every year for damage and at the risk of jinxing me for next year, I haven't seen any yet.

I did burn a lot of wood in the early years through it so maybe there is a microscopic bonding layer of creosote that is protecting it from the rust.
I drive a VW TDI, heat my home & workshop with two coal stokers and have two vintage JD diesel tractors....
The EPA just loves me!!

User avatar
McGiever
Member
Posts: 5997
Joined: Sun. May. 02, 2010 11:26 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: AXEMAN-ANDERSON 130 "1959"
Coal Size/Type: PEA / ANTHRACITE
Other Heating: Ground Source Heat Pump
Stove/Furnace Make: Hydro Heat /Mega Tek
Location: Junction of PA-OH-WV

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 11:43 am

SS liners are not all equal, uninsulated flex being the worst.

The big controversy is that for the casual reader to happen along and reads just a "snippet" of someone saying "It's no big deal just throw in a SS flex liner and you're good to go cause you got a warranty, the building inspector approves and you can just throw in a free replacement liner and the stove will hardly go cold in the meantime.

It ain't that easy and...No...you are not the exception and "just might get lucky" and beat the odds this one time. ;)

Sorry :(
SLOW AND STEADY WINS THE RACE

User avatar
scalabro
Member
Posts: 2808
Joined: Wed. Oct. 03, 2012 9:53 am
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40's, PP Stewart No. 14, Abendroth Bros "Record 40"
Coal Size/Type: Stove / Anthracite.
Other Heating: Oil fired, forced hot air.
Location: Southwick Massachusetts

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 12:02 pm

McGiever wrote:SS liners are not all equal, uninsulated flex being the worst.

The big controversy is that for the casual reader to happen along and reads just a "snippet" of someone saying "It's no big deal just throw in a SS flex liner and you're good to go cause you got a warranty, the building inspector approves and you can just throw in a free replacement liner and the stove will hardly go cold in the meantime.

It ain't that easy and...No...you are not the exception and "just might get lucky" and beat the odds this one time. ;)

Sorry :(
No need to be sorry.

I'm very satisfied with its performance two years and six + tons in, so if I have to replace it in less than 10 years, so be it.

You can be sure I will post its condition every year either way.

User avatar
scalabro
Member
Posts: 2808
Joined: Wed. Oct. 03, 2012 9:53 am
Baseburners & Antiques: 2 Crawford 40's, PP Stewart No. 14, Abendroth Bros "Record 40"
Coal Size/Type: Stove / Anthracite.
Other Heating: Oil fired, forced hot air.
Location: Southwick Massachusetts

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 12:09 pm

[quote="freetown fred"]Hell gecko, that wasn't bashing, that was just a fact. National code states ya gotta have black or SS pipe up to clay tile--any chimneys I've done start the clay tile just above the smoke shelf--maybe 4 ft or so of pipe--no argument there[quote="Gekko"][quote="freetown fred"]

Dude ...... Read.

I needed a liner to comply with code because my flue is to big.

WTF? If I could have gotten away with it just to the first tiles I would have....geeze!

User avatar
warminmn
Member
Posts: 2480
Joined: Tue. Feb. 08, 2011 5:59 pm
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Chubby Junior, Efel Nestor Martin, Frankenstove
Coal Size/Type: nut and stove anthracite
Other Heating: wood and a little LP
Location: Land of 11,842 lakes, not 10,000

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 2:05 pm

[quote="titleist1"]If the masonry chimney can't be used, would it be a better investment to put in a insulated double wall SS chimney in the large flue rather than a flexible single wall liner? Maybe the projected lifespan out weighs the cost difference?

I've wondered the exact same thing. It would sure be easier and cheaper to replace if and when the time comes.

I'm on my 3rd year with coal thru my outside stainless dura vent double wall so time will tell for me. Mine shows rust on the outside already. I burnt wood maybe 10 years thru it first. I think maybe the soot has all the connections plugged up and that helps stop the coal ash problems, plus a little soot in the pipe too as I burn wood early and late in the year.

I decided 3 years ago, the hell with it. I'll burn until its rotten then replace it and continue that same cycle. Its a lot easier then worrying about it. Its a personal decision we all make.
I'm just an old chunk of coal now Lord but I'm gonna be a diamond some day - Billy Joe Shaver

User avatar
coalder
Member
Posts: 1000
Joined: Mon. Dec. 16, 2013 1:48 pm
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: harman sf 160
Coal Size/Type: Nut
Other Heating: wood parlor stove
Location: somewhere high in the catskill mountains

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 3:23 pm

Warminmn, You might be on to something, with the wood. I have a good friend locally who also is a coal burner. He has a very large shop with cathedral ceiling. He has about 4 sections of regular stovepipe going up to the insulated pipe. I believe this is his 6th yr, and he finishes every season with wood. OK only been 6yrs however The black stovepipe looks like new and no sign of any oxidation in his unit. I'm about to do the same in a few days when coal runs out.
Jim
What paralyzes life, is failure to believe, and failure to dare.
"Author unknown".

User avatar
warminmn
Member
Posts: 2480
Joined: Tue. Feb. 08, 2011 5:59 pm
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Chubby Junior, Efel Nestor Martin, Frankenstove
Coal Size/Type: nut and stove anthracite
Other Heating: wood and a little LP
Location: Land of 11,842 lakes, not 10,000

Post Sat. Mar. 22, 2014 4:17 pm

I wish I could take credit about the wood but cant. I learned that from this wonderful forum.
I'm just an old chunk of coal now Lord but I'm gonna be a diamond some day - Billy Joe Shaver


Post Reply

Return to “Coal News & General Coal Discussions”