Castable Refractory Cement

Modern and vintage hand fired coal stove are similar to a wood stove and in some cases can burn either. They need to be regulated and fed by hand usually every 12 to 24 hours depending on your usage. They require no power to operate making them ideal for rural settings with long power outages.
CapeCoaler
Member
Posts: 4429
Joined: Sun. Feb. 10, 2008 3:48 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: want AA130
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine BS#4, Harman MKII, Hitzer 503,...
Coal Size/Type: Pea/Nut/Stove
Location: Cape Cod, MA

Post Sun. Feb. 01, 2009 12:00 am

Looking for recommendations for a quality product.
Casting refractory bricks for coal stove use.
Some 45* angles some curves.
If you have worked with or have knowledge of cast-able refractory cement and can point me in the right direction I want your help!
The cement that was being used is no longer available and have had a few experiences with bad product trying to find the right manufacturer and product.
The refractory Russo used was very good, withstood the ravages of a coal fire well, if you know the manufacturer's name that would be great!
I am not an engineer, train or otherwise!
I stay at a Holiday Inn at least once a year!
Most of all I do have common sense and a practical application of logic.
Oh, add humor, on the dry side, along with a wee bit 'o sarcasm.

Visit Hitzer Stoves

franco b
Site Moderator
Posts: 8437
Joined: Wed. Nov. 05, 2008 5:11 pm
Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
Coal Size/Type: nut and pea
Location: Kent CT

Post Mon. Feb. 02, 2009 12:43 pm

I don't remember the name of the manufacturer, but it was purchased from a supply house that catered to pottery makers. It was used in the construction of kilns. You could look up pottery supplies in the phone book to see if there is anything local to you.

Richard

User avatar
coaledsweat
Site Moderator
Posts: 9826
Joined: Fri. Oct. 27, 2006 2:05 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260M
Coal Size/Type: Pea
Location: Guilford, Connecticut

Post Mon. Feb. 02, 2009 5:06 pm

There are plenty of commercial sources that you can google. If you are adventurous, try this.

http://www.visi.com/~darus/foundry2/refractory.html
Nothing is impossible for people who don't have to do it themselves.

rberq
Member
Posts: 5014
Joined: Mon. Apr. 16, 2007 9:34 pm
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300 with hopper
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators (fuel oil); propane
Location: Central Maine

Post Mon. Feb. 02, 2009 6:50 pm

Neat idea, the perlite and furnace cement. One thing I don't understand: they recommend adding water to the mix to make it easier to work with. But what happens to all that water as the cement sets? Or isn't this anything like the mortar mix used to build a chimney?

How strong would the resulting product be? Would a quarter-inch thick sheet be self-supporting, and take a bit of bashing around, if installed at a slant against the baffle plate on my stove?
Simple answers for simple minds.

User avatar
coaledsweat
Site Moderator
Posts: 9826
Joined: Fri. Oct. 27, 2006 2:05 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260M
Coal Size/Type: Pea
Location: Guilford, Connecticut

Post Mon. Feb. 02, 2009 7:44 pm

Refractory needs to be thick and cured, then fired for it to last any length of time. If you want something that thin you will need some specialty product I'm sure, but it looks like trouble.
Nothing is impossible for people who don't have to do it themselves.

rberq
Member
Posts: 5014
Joined: Mon. Apr. 16, 2007 9:34 pm
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300 with hopper
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators (fuel oil); propane
Location: Central Maine

Post Mon. Feb. 02, 2009 9:28 pm

coaledsweat wrote:If you want something that thin you will need some specialty product I'm sure, but it looks like trouble.
Thanks, coaledsweat. I often stuff my stove with coal, and some contacts the baffle plate or sits very close to it. I don't know if that will lead to premature burnout, so I was looking for a way to give it a little protection. Actually, since the coal burns less on the top compared to deep in the bed, the coal bed may settle before that area burns, and I may be concerned about nothing. All in all, I don't worry much about it. I figure the stove is there to give heat, so if the baffle burns out, I will think about it when that time comes.
Simple answers for simple minds.

CapeCoaler
Member
Posts: 4429
Joined: Sun. Feb. 10, 2008 3:48 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: want AA130
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine BS#4, Harman MKII, Hitzer 503,...
Coal Size/Type: Pea/Nut/Stove
Location: Cape Cod, MA

Post Mon. Feb. 02, 2009 10:19 pm

Did some hunting and research.
For the castings we need a high density and abrasion resistant mix.
130-145 lb cu/ft
The normal stuff may work 'able cast 3000'
Found a specialty product for high/frequent temp swings $80 for 50lb
Has high fused silica content, glass.
http://www.ablerefractory.com/products%20castable.html

The materials for kilns are really not suitable for a coal firebox as a kiln has no abrasion just heat.
Cone 10 here we come!

Each cone is made to melt at a different temperature.
Cone 10 melts at 2350 degrees which is considered high fired stoneware.
At this high temperature, the clay becomes vitreous and is the strongest of the clay bodies.
I am not an engineer, train or otherwise!
I stay at a Holiday Inn at least once a year!
Most of all I do have common sense and a practical application of logic.
Oh, add humor, on the dry side, along with a wee bit 'o sarcasm.

User avatar
coaledsweat
Site Moderator
Posts: 9826
Joined: Fri. Oct. 27, 2006 2:05 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: Axeman Anderson 260M
Coal Size/Type: Pea
Location: Guilford, Connecticut

Post Mon. Feb. 02, 2009 11:09 pm

You do realize we are going to need pics and details of this one. :)
Nothing is impossible for people who don't have to do it themselves.

Visit Hitzer Stoves

CapeCoaler
Member
Posts: 4429
Joined: Sun. Feb. 10, 2008 3:48 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: want AA130
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine BS#4, Harman MKII, Hitzer 503,...
Coal Size/Type: Pea/Nut/Stove
Location: Cape Cod, MA

Post Tue. Feb. 03, 2009 12:06 am

The kiln @ cone 10 or the heavy duty refractory?
My parents rented to a potter and he built pottery kilns in addition to doing his own firings.
Many a cone 10 party! Took the better part of a day, the flame and the glow were crazy at night.
The stoves are rebuilds of the Newcastle stove from Iron House in Hyannis.
They have started building them again new also.
Nice solid design round grate.
I am not an engineer, train or otherwise!
I stay at a Holiday Inn at least once a year!
Most of all I do have common sense and a practical application of logic.
Oh, add humor, on the dry side, along with a wee bit 'o sarcasm.

User avatar
Poconoeagle
Member
Posts: 6403
Joined: Sat. Nov. 08, 2008 7:26 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: Buckwalter & Co. , EFM520
Stove/Furnace Model: No. 28 Glenwood 1880, Alaska
Location: Tobyhanna PA

Post Tue. Feb. 03, 2009 12:38 am

http://www.fornobravo.com/

a favorite site of mine. free to join in the forum on building the Pompeii there is much info on refractory....

best comes from Lamoines France I think :roll:
"Do it Right the First Time" dont leave it for the next guy, as YOU may be the Next guy!!

CapeCoaler
Member
Posts: 4429
Joined: Sun. Feb. 10, 2008 3:48 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: want AA130
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine BS#4, Harman MKII, Hitzer 503,...
Coal Size/Type: Pea/Nut/Stove
Location: Cape Cod, MA

Post Tue. Feb. 03, 2009 1:14 am

I went to the oven and train sites looking for refractory that will stand up to the abuse of a small coal stove.
Temp swings, coal tossed and humans poking the fire!
Ovens and pottery has no abrasive factors to consider.
Trains tend to be bigger so less wall whacking with the shovel or poker.
I figure down in Texas they make some heat in the refineries and heavy manufacturing.
So I am going with the industrial side to over design the refractory castings.
Able seems to have a good mix and can provide pallet quantities.
I am still looking for other vendors and manufacturers to try out their mixes.
I am not an engineer, train or otherwise!
I stay at a Holiday Inn at least once a year!
Most of all I do have common sense and a practical application of logic.
Oh, add humor, on the dry side, along with a wee bit 'o sarcasm.

CapeCoaler
Member
Posts: 4429
Joined: Sun. Feb. 10, 2008 3:48 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: want AA130
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine BS#4, Harman MKII, Hitzer 503,...
Coal Size/Type: Pea/Nut/Stove
Location: Cape Cod, MA

Post Tue. Feb. 03, 2009 1:37 am

Found another source
http://www.hwr.com/
Has a sales office in West Haven CT
Will give them a shout in the morning.
I am not an engineer, train or otherwise!
I stay at a Holiday Inn at least once a year!
Most of all I do have common sense and a practical application of logic.
Oh, add humor, on the dry side, along with a wee bit 'o sarcasm.

User avatar
UpStateMike
Member
Posts: 103
Joined: Mon. Nov. 03, 2008 1:58 pm
Stove/Furnace Make: Elmira Oval (in house)
Stove/Furnace Model: Round Oak d-18 (workshop)
Location: South New Berlin, NY

Post Tue. Feb. 03, 2009 11:34 am

I like the idea of casting your own custom firebricks. My stove has rounded one and they are not cheap.

Ideally one could get an tougher industrial casting mix, create the bricks, allow them to air dry (aka greenware) and then ask a kindly local potter or school to fire them for you. If you want to really MacGuyver it, wait til Summer and you can make a kiln by digging a hole, burying the "pots" and then covering with a couple face cord of wood http://www.biocoal.org/10.html . Probably want to make some multiples if you go though that trouble, and make me a nice ashtry for cigars while your at it.
You can put your boots in the oven, but that don't make 'em Biscuits - Grandma

CapeCoaler
Member
Posts: 4429
Joined: Sun. Feb. 10, 2008 3:48 pm
Stoker Coal Boiler: want AA130
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine BS#4, Harman MKII, Hitzer 503,...
Coal Size/Type: Pea/Nut/Stove
Location: Cape Cod, MA

Post Tue. Feb. 03, 2009 2:15 pm

Refractory castings do not need to be fired in a kiln.
Pour it, dry it then slowly heat it.
Treat refractory like green cast iron.
Making your own fire brick is a different story.
I am not an engineer, train or otherwise!
I stay at a Holiday Inn at least once a year!
Most of all I do have common sense and a practical application of logic.
Oh, add humor, on the dry side, along with a wee bit 'o sarcasm.

BIG BEAM
Member
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri. Jan. 25, 2008 9:34 am
Stove/Furnace Make: USS Hot blast
Stove/Furnace Model: 1557M
Location: upstate NY

Post Tue. Feb. 03, 2009 7:30 pm

How about this.
**Broken Link(s) Removed**DON

Visit Hitzer Stoves

Post Reply

Return to “Hand Fired Coal Stoves & Furnaces Using Anthracite”