Kerosene?

I never thought kerosene heaters were at all safe in the house, but it turns out they are--with the precautions of any other form of fuel. They need no venting chimney.

For me, the common 24,000 BTU heater should be enough in polar storms to supplement my coal stove, and you can move it around (but not left running in a bedroom).

My yard man told me he gets free kerosene from the county--they give it away when temps get dangerous. Users say the right fuel does not smell or smoke, and lasts many years (unlike gasoline or diesel). It is expensive in stores, but pretty cheap at gas stations that have it.

If your cold anything is acceptable ( even with small clean burning flame I can smell fuel long before I enter the room) but they’ve made some incredible material science developments in the last 30-40 yrs , back in the olden days it was just a low quality sheet metal / stainless mesh wick housing , now with iridium, platinum etc platings/alloys they catalyze the exhaust particles much better , still not my first choice for inside the house ( but I’ve also burned some crazy stuff in my stove in lean times 1/4 of a detergent bottle and not seasoned enough wood !)

Kerosene produces toxic carbon monoxide, CO2, and other dangerous exhaust, in addition to using up indoor oxygen. They were banned for sale in Suffolk County over 30 years ago because people thought that since they don't hook up to a chimney, they must burn clean.

It's still a hydrocarbon and it will kill you if you breath enough of it. Does it say use with "adequate ventilation", but do they tell you what is adequate ? usually the "adequate cross ventilation" is about equal to the heat produced so you don't gain much heat before it's replaced with cold outside air.

Carbon monoxide is odorless and even in small doses it easily accumulates in your system slowly blocking oxygen absorption.

Paul

charlesosborne2002 wrote: ↑

Mon. Dec. 26, 2022 12:19 pm

<SNIP>

They need no venting chimney.

Well, they don't need chimney to operate, that's true.

Ideally, fuel burns to produce CO2 and water. But life is not ideal, nor is combustion. I have a kero burner. Nice in a drafty garage. Would not be so nice in a more buttoned up house, due to unwanted combustion products of carbon monoxide, for example. The CO2 ? It would increase the house atm. CO2 level .. ..something to consider and check out in more detail as that that aspect.

I would not recommend running a kero heater inside a home.

Our k-1 kerosene stoves were sold to use in the house and we used them to supplement electric baseboard heat on a cold concrete slab house during some brutally cold winters, the blizzard of 1978 being one of those.

No one ever said anything back then about carbon monoxide and we used good clean fuel. Always started and extinguished them outside in the garage or outside, which was a pain. Never had a single problem then, aside from regular wick maintenance/replacement and if you did that there wasn’t any issue.

I’m sure our house wasn’t all that tight, but we survived and was warmer for them during some bad times.

Today I have 2 newer round k-1 stoves, both had wick’s replaced about 5 years ago and waiting to be called upon. I’d have no reservations about using them in the house if needed…accept now I have a coal/wood stove and don’t need them, but I also have 3 CO detectors.

About my CO detectors…
One is a digital readout and plugged into a wall outlet about 4 feet off the floor. The other two are CO/Smoke alarms with no digital readout and they are on the ceiling.

I guess I should have researched this more…

1. I am uncertain if our CO alarms can detect gas from our propane cook stove should a valve get bumped open?

2. Should alarms for CO and gas (propane or NG) be mounted high or low? Near the floor or ceiling?

This is probably a good topic for its own thread with a good title name.

https://www.mass.gov/news/kerosene-heaters-illega ... sachusetts

This as far back as 1981 & 1982.
https://www.nytimes.com/1981/11/14/style/consumer ... aters.html
https://www.nytimes.com/1982/12/19/nyregion/a-ban ... cials.html

https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/small-space-heaters
"Small space heaters are classified as vented and unvented or "vent-free." Unvented combustion small space heaters are not recommended for use inside your home because of the risk of carbon monoxide poisoning. They may also bring unwanted nitrogen oxide into the home; nitrogen oxide can cause asthma and other respiratory problems. These heaters can also introduce water vapor into the home, which can result in mold and other structural damage. Most states have banned unvented kerosene heaters for use in the home. California, and some other cities and counties, have banned the use of unvented natural gas heaters in the home. "

Lost my cousin and his wife on their honeymoon in Catskills in 70s(some type kerosene space heater exhaust got blocked ( 2/3 days no one from the resort checked on them because they thought they were just holed up from the cold weather doing what you do on your honeymoon.

My mother in law grew up in a very rural (back then ) bungalow fishing community , she’s explained the heat system as best she could ( it held about 11/2 quarts of kero similar to a large Coleman stove burner ( you would fill the tank pump up the pressure and it would last 4-5 hours ) this too was in a giant galvanized box under the floor actual burner was in a smaller box that allowed air in and exhaust out without tainting house air ( crawl space ) 20 -30 min and the heat would be cranking ( no fans no nothing you could raise the flame and adjust the air but was easy to start making soot if you got it wrong ) 50s timeframe

I’m well aware of reports, dangers, and bans. Just because a few places ban something doesn’t mean the entire country should follow suit. It only means to beware and use more caution.

They banned 3 wheel atv’s too but you can still buy a 3-wheeler for the highway…and they tip just as easy as the old atv’s.


1. I live in Ohio and they still sell them here, in fact, everyday at the local TSC. Breathing is breathing whether asleep in a home or awake in a shop. Either way the dangers still exist. Not making light of that. But if they were indeed that deadly they would have already been outlawed in this PC society that we live in.

2. A label on a box doesn’t stop people from using them where the label says not to, or emergency use situations.

3. I have a furnace in addition to electric heaters and a wood stove, and the k-1’s would only see use In an extreme emergency…like losing power…and losing use of my current wood/coal stove (very unlikely…which is why I own it).

4. Detectors should be in every home, though half the time they don’t work for most.

4. Safe to assume most forum members in any stove forum have enough sense to know to crack some windows. I fear my coal stove more than my k-1 heaters if for nothing but I use the stove more often.

5. Should I go on….LOL!

6. Many Amish homes still heat and cool with k-1 stoves. Seen them in use at the coalpail gtg a few years back. Don’t see how anyone could eat a pie made on one of those things. Yuck!!! LOL!


Wasn’t in any way implying using in normal situations in my home…although not much different than using in my garage and needing to work out there in an emergency during the day. I see it as being no different than a very large propane work heater.

Besides, there are ways to mitigate their use at night if one would be so concerned.

I think it was in the 1970s that an American airline pilot noticed how popular these stoves were in Japan and how nicely they were made. He decided to import them and Kerosun was born which quickly became very popular and in great demand.

Eventually Consumer Reports did an article on them which revealed the down side of pollutants. That article was pretty much the death of them.

https://www.ruralking.com/sengoku-23500-btu-porta ... ater-cv23k

Still sell them everyday…different name is all.

#1 fuel oil (K-1) is more refined than #2 fuel oil and both are made from crude.

My Thermo-pride furnace runs on it, #1 or #2 oil.

Kuma makes stoves that burn it today. https://www.kumastoves.com/Content/Page/oil-stove

It will burn #1 fuel oil, or K-1…here read page 3…
https://kumastorage.blob.core.windows.net/content ... 207-18.pdf

With properly maintained k-1 heaters and wicks there’s no more reason to be scared of them than any of the examples given above.

I’ve seen first hand what a furnace malfunction can do and it’ll make you want to remove the unit if it malfunctions. That’s why we supposed to do preventive maintenance and checks with any type of unit, be it a k-1 heater, furnace, wood stove, chimney, etc. Life is NOT without certain risks. The main thing is to educate yourself or those risks and how to mitigate them…which is why I think a discussion on detector placement is a high priority. Little is said about it.

Hoytman wrote: ↑

Mon. Dec. 26, 2022 2:16 pm

About my CO detectors…
One is a digital readout and plugged into a wall outlet about 4 feet off the floor. The other two are CO/Smoke alarms with no digital readout and they are on the ceiling.

I guess I should have researched this more…

1. I am uncertain if our CO alarms can detect gas from our propane cook stove should a valve get bumped open?

2. Should alarms for CO and gas (propane or NG) be mounted high or low? Near the floor or ceiling?

This is probably a good topic for its own thread with a good title name.

Yah, bump on this. Placement has got to matter, I would love to know best placement and way to test my detectors! Kids in the house is too great a cost

Try this pdf file.

I researched the Kumo stoves years ago. Nice units, vented, efficient, but not cheap. I would not use an unvented heater in my house unless freezing.

warminmn wrote: ↑

Mon. Dec. 26, 2022 7:47 pm

I researched the Kumo stoves years ago. Nice units, vented, efficient, but not cheap. I would not use an unvented heater in my house unless freezing.

Neither would I, this the reason I gave under which circumstances I would use them.

Many people used them for years. Yes, some died. Same can be said if coal stove use and home fires from wood stove use and dirty chimney’s catching fire.

I’m not trying to downplay the dangers just trying to be realistic. Tens of thousands die yearly of drunk driving and/or alcohol poisoning. No one has banned that yet. Heck…this day and age people are wanting to legalize drugs. The PC crowd has just about wiped out the entire tobacco industry and yet this sale crown promotes Mary Jane use. Go figure! Strain at a gnat and swallow a camel.