Redirecting Secondary Air in a 983.
- Keepaeyeonit
- Member
- Posts: 1680
- Joined: Wed. Mar. 24, 2010 7:18 pm
- Location: Northeast Ohio.( Grand river wine country )
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #8
- Coal Size/Type: Nut & stove
- Other Heating: 49 year old oil furnace, and finally a new heat pump
I have been toying with the idea for sometime of getting the secondary air over the fuel bed and just dumping it at the top of the fire box like Hitzer did on the 983, As you will see in the photo below.
After looking at some of the other stove designs and some custom made pipes other members have made I went ahead with the task at hand of fabricating a set of pipes that would get the air right over the fuel bed, Well that idea sounded easer then it turned out to be.
During the process I was constantly running into some kind of clearance issue, pipes were hitting the window retainer, hitting the corner of the door frame, and the list goes on , plus I only had the idea in my head and not a single drawing so It was a fly by the seat of my pants kinda a thing working with a Sawzall, 4 1/2" grinder,small stick welder, and a torch although I did mill out the pockets of the sq tube at work on a Bridgeport. The only modifications I made to the stove was drilling (4) 17/64'' holes to mount the pipes and removing (2) angle pcs over the brick retainer (not sure what there for but I always thought there were a PITA when cleaning time came) so If I have to remove them I will just plug the (4) holes with bolts and be on my marry way. They fit ok of but not as good as I would have liked, I wanted them to sit just behind the brick retainer to keep them away from the burning coal but there sitting just inside (towards the fire) of it, and I would have liked them to sit more parallel to the brick retainer so In short there not perfect but If I make another set I will do the cutting and bending at work where I have all the right stuff to work with.
I was going to light it up yesterday but some where along the line I punched out the window oh well I guess I will be calling the boys at Hitzer tomorrow morning!!
I will update this as time goes on. Keepaeyeonit
Now I'm sure this helped with keeping the window clean but time will tell if I need to change or try something different in that area.After looking at some of the other stove designs and some custom made pipes other members have made I went ahead with the task at hand of fabricating a set of pipes that would get the air right over the fuel bed, Well that idea sounded easer then it turned out to be.
During the process I was constantly running into some kind of clearance issue, pipes were hitting the window retainer, hitting the corner of the door frame, and the list goes on , plus I only had the idea in my head and not a single drawing so It was a fly by the seat of my pants kinda a thing working with a Sawzall, 4 1/2" grinder,small stick welder, and a torch although I did mill out the pockets of the sq tube at work on a Bridgeport. The only modifications I made to the stove was drilling (4) 17/64'' holes to mount the pipes and removing (2) angle pcs over the brick retainer (not sure what there for but I always thought there were a PITA when cleaning time came) so If I have to remove them I will just plug the (4) holes with bolts and be on my marry way. They fit ok of but not as good as I would have liked, I wanted them to sit just behind the brick retainer to keep them away from the burning coal but there sitting just inside (towards the fire) of it, and I would have liked them to sit more parallel to the brick retainer so In short there not perfect but If I make another set I will do the cutting and bending at work where I have all the right stuff to work with.
I was going to light it up yesterday but some where along the line I punched out the window oh well I guess I will be calling the boys at Hitzer tomorrow morning!!
I will update this as time goes on. Keepaeyeonit
- Ky Speedracer
- Member
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- Joined: Sun. Dec. 21, 2014 9:38 pm
- Location: Middletown, Kentucky
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Florence HotBlast NO.68 & Potbelly
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: HotBlast 1557M
- Coal Size/Type: Ky Lump & Anthracite Nut
- Other Heating: Oil
I like the concept. I've done something similar in my stove but have not had any cold weather to speak of to try what I've done yet.
I'm not familiar with your stove. I think I see the secondary air control at the top of the door. How does it get from the there "into" your secondary burn tubes? Is there a connection of some sort?
I'm not familiar with your stove. I think I see the secondary air control at the top of the door. How does it get from the there "into" your secondary burn tubes? Is there a connection of some sort?
- Keepaeyeonit
- Member
- Posts: 1680
- Joined: Wed. Mar. 24, 2010 7:18 pm
- Location: Northeast Ohio.( Grand river wine country )
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #8
- Coal Size/Type: Nut & stove
- Other Heating: 49 year old oil furnace, and finally a new heat pump
If you look at the first pic you can see the air ducts (just inside the fire box) and the slide control ( just above the load door on the outside) , I just milled out the 2 pockets of the Sq tube for the air and I used flat gasket to seal where the tube meets the existing air inlet,
The stove already had adjustable secondary air but it dumped it right at the top at the load door and not buy the coal bed.- Ky Speedracer
- Member
- Posts: 492
- Joined: Sun. Dec. 21, 2014 9:38 pm
- Location: Middletown, Kentucky
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Florence HotBlast NO.68 & Potbelly
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: HotBlast 1557M
- Coal Size/Type: Ky Lump & Anthracite Nut
- Other Heating: Oil
Ahhh, I see it now! I didn't see the cutout on the back of the tubes. Gotcha! Nice work.
- Lightning
- Site Moderator
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- Joined: Wed. Nov. 16, 2011 9:51 am
- Location: Olean, NY
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Modified AA 130
- Coal Size/Type: Pea Size - Anthracite
Hey nice job! And I like the fact that you have independent control of the secondary air volume. I'm looking forward to seeing some pics or hopefully a video clip of it in action.
- Keepaeyeonit
- Member
- Posts: 1680
- Joined: Wed. Mar. 24, 2010 7:18 pm
- Location: Northeast Ohio.( Grand river wine country )
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #8
- Coal Size/Type: Nut & stove
- Other Heating: 49 year old oil furnace, and finally a new heat pump
Ok now It got kinda cooler out I was able to light the stove on 11/12/2015, I've been running around 250° to 280° with 24 Hr reload times using 20 to 25 Lbs of Direnzo nut. I think I'm not getting enough air through the 3/4" pipes but I'm not sure If I can do anything about It because of the limited space I have. I will see how It does when I'm running hotter.
I posted a video on Youtube on me reloading the stove, sorry It's a shitty video but towards the end you can see the pipes in action.
I will stew on this all winter to see if I can cram bigger pipes or go to a rectangular tube.
https://youtu.be/4zV6P_xlyq4
I posted a video on Youtube on me reloading the stove, sorry It's a shitty video but towards the end you can see the pipes in action.
I will stew on this all winter to see if I can cram bigger pipes or go to a rectangular tube.
https://youtu.be/4zV6P_xlyq4
- Lightning
- Site Moderator
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- Joined: Wed. Nov. 16, 2011 9:51 am
- Location: Olean, NY
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Modified AA 130
- Coal Size/Type: Pea Size - Anthracite
Yeah that's pretty cool man! Maybe you could just bore the holes out to get a little more air flow. I just did that to my secondary pipes recently. I notice flames around the air wash coming in around the glass it seems too.
- Keepaeyeonit
- Member
- Posts: 1680
- Joined: Wed. Mar. 24, 2010 7:18 pm
- Location: Northeast Ohio.( Grand river wine country )
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #8
- Coal Size/Type: Nut & stove
- Other Heating: 49 year old oil furnace, and finally a new heat pump
I started out with 3/16" holes and I already opened them up to 1/4", I'm not sure If I will go bigger or not. The back holes work much better then the front ones do and I'm not sure why?
- lsayre
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- Location: Ohio
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Currents?Keepaeyeonit wrote:I started out with 3/16" holes and I already opened them up to 1/4", I'm not sure If I will go bigger or not. The back holes work much better then the front ones do and I'm not sure why?
- SWPaDon
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I thought it was a great video. I could see the left tube working early on, flames appeared to be over 3 inches long when it first lit up.
- Lightning
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 14658
- Joined: Wed. Nov. 16, 2011 9:51 am
- Location: Olean, NY
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Modified AA 130
- Coal Size/Type: Pea Size - Anthracite
I seem to see more flames towards the back with mine also. I haven't been able to come with a reasonable explanation either.Keepaeyeonit wrote:I started out with 3/16" holes and I already opened them up to 1/4", I'm not sure If I will go bigger or not. The back holes work much better then the front ones do and I'm not sure why?
- Keepaeyeonit
- Member
- Posts: 1680
- Joined: Wed. Mar. 24, 2010 7:18 pm
- Location: Northeast Ohio.( Grand river wine country )
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood #8
- Coal Size/Type: Nut & stove
- Other Heating: 49 year old oil furnace, and finally a new heat pump
Yes Larry I was thinking the same thing, Lee, I was thinking maybe the air is much hotter after going through the pipe getting heated along the way.l'm sure that's the reason some Base burners use preheated air, member Ky Speedracer's did a great fab job on his plus the air has a lot of surface to travel and pick up heat so I'm waiting to see how his works.
- Ky Speedracer
- Member
- Posts: 492
- Joined: Sun. Dec. 21, 2014 9:38 pm
- Location: Middletown, Kentucky
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Florence HotBlast NO.68 & Potbelly
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: HotBlast 1557M
- Coal Size/Type: Ky Lump & Anthracite Nut
- Other Heating: Oil
Thanks for the compliment.Keepaeyeonit wrote:member Ky Speedracer's did a great fab job on his plus the air has a lot of surface to travel and pick up heat so I'm waiting to see how his works.
I made a post on my thread, Pre-Heated Secondary Air Modification…Is This Possible? . It's a ridiculously long post, sorry (possibly a record on here? Lol). I didn't want to write it again here so just follow the link if you're interested.
The bottom line is I need to go back to work and reroute my secondary tubes to get independant control of them separate from the primary control.