Box Stove to Base Heater Conversion Adventure

 
rberq
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Posts: 6445
Joined: Mon. Apr. 16, 2007 9:34 pm
Location: Central Maine
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300 with hopper
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators (fuel oil); propane

Post by rberq » Sun. Dec. 10, 2017 8:57 pm

KingCoal wrote:
Sun. Dec. 10, 2017 5:29 pm
i have decided on a non invasive approach to double heating for this yr. pics coming soon.
Non-invasive??? I'm eager to see what you are up to now. :yes:


 
KingCoal
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Posts: 4837
Joined: Wed. Apr. 03, 2013 1:24 pm
Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 10:35 am

you'll probably be disappointed. i just decided not to bother disassembling and covering the original primary air system and adding it back on in a new location.

instead i'm just going to set up 2 external double heater ducts to drive a figure 8 convection loop.

it's going to be all function and no one is likely to be impressed or want to copy it.

 
rberq
Member
Posts: 6445
Joined: Mon. Apr. 16, 2007 9:34 pm
Location: Central Maine
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300 with hopper
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators (fuel oil); propane

Post by rberq » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 1:11 pm

KingCoal wrote:
Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 10:35 am
it's going to be all function and no one is likely to be impressed or want to copy it.
Probably WILL be impressed but will NOT want to copy it. ;)

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25547
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 3:33 pm

KingCoal wrote:
Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 10:35 am
you'll probably be disappointed. i just decided not to bother disassembling and covering the original primary air system and adding it back on in a new location.

instead i'm just going to set up 2 external double heater ducts to drive a figure 8 convection loop.

it's going to be all function and no one is likely to be impressed or want to copy it.

So you are going to duct around them rather than move them ?

Paul

 
KingCoal
Member
Posts: 4837
Joined: Wed. Apr. 03, 2013 1:24 pm
Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 3:42 pm

kind of, i'm more interested in finding out how much circulation volume i can get in the simplest fashion to see if it's worth going any further.

i'll get some pics up when i can.

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25547
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 6:07 pm

I can't help but think there's might good reasons why they are located where they are.

Paul

 
KingCoal
Member
Posts: 4837
Joined: Wed. Apr. 03, 2013 1:24 pm
Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Mon. Dec. 11, 2017 6:35 pm

came home and realized one of my "duct" paths just won't work in present lay out.

i can do one of them but not both, so i probably will but will also go forward with modeling of a bracket to support the bi metal box in a new location.


 
KingCoal
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Posts: 4837
Joined: Wed. Apr. 03, 2013 1:24 pm
Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Mon. Jan. 01, 2018 7:39 pm

still no progress on fitting a double heater feature to this stove but...

it's -14 wc outside, it's 73* one room away from the stove. running in base mode at -.03 Mano.

652* on stove 130* at the thimble, lots of throttle left just need to be careful of ignition point of painted wood work and trim in stove area. :o

 
KingCoal
Member
Posts: 4837
Joined: Wed. Apr. 03, 2013 1:24 pm
Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Mon. Jan. 01, 2018 8:13 pm

hmm, there is a spot of trim just beyond the heat shield and 20" from the nearest edge of the stove that's showing 192*

bare wood spontaneous ignition is around 550* so i'm probably ok for now.

 
KingCoal
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Posts: 4837
Joined: Wed. Apr. 03, 2013 1:24 pm
Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Thu. Oct. 11, 2018 8:37 pm

well, FRANK is back on the hearth all hooked up for the next six days of 50 highs and 35 lows. it's going back to the 60's after that so i'll be letting it go back out.

right now it's 48 with 10 mph breeze, the chimney is pulling .02 above the fire bed with the primary closed and 3 inches of half burned nut on the grates from the last clean out this spring.

it's 60 IAT so that's decent natural draft.

gave up on the rear mounted double heater project for this stove, just too many obstructions and limited space.

i am however finished with the modeling stage of double heater passages for each of the sides. once i quit focusing on what wasn't working this idea came pretty quickly, it kind of reapplies the circulator idea to the stove but in a much more effective design.

pics to follow,
steve

 
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Sunny Boy
Member
Posts: 25547
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Thu. Oct. 11, 2018 9:01 pm

KingCoal wrote:
Thu. Oct. 11, 2018 8:37 pm
well, FRANK is back on the hearth all hooked up for the next six days of 50 highs and 35 lows. it's going back to the 60's after that so i'll be letting it go back out.

right now it's 48 with 10 mph breeze, the chimney is pulling .02 above the fire bed with the primary closed and 3 inches of half burned nut on the grates from the last clean out this spring.

it's 60 IAT so that's decent natural draft.

gave up on the rear mounted double heater project for this stove, just too many obstructions and limited space.

i am however finished with the modeling stage of double heater passages for each of the sides. once i quit focusing on what wasn't working this idea came pretty quickly, it kind of reapplies the circulator idea to the stove but in a much more effective design.

pics to follow,
steve

Looking forward to see how this project progresses. :yes:

Paul

 
rberq
Member
Posts: 6445
Joined: Mon. Apr. 16, 2007 9:34 pm
Location: Central Maine
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300 with hopper
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators (fuel oil); propane

Post by rberq » Fri. Oct. 12, 2018 11:09 am

Sunny Boy wrote:
Thu. Oct. 11, 2018 9:01 pm
Looking forward to see how this project progresses.
+1 :!:

 
KingCoal
Member
Posts: 4837
Joined: Wed. Apr. 03, 2013 1:24 pm
Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Fri. Oct. 12, 2018 6:34 pm

RB, this one is real simple i'm sure you'll like it.

steve

 
rberq
Member
Posts: 6445
Joined: Mon. Apr. 16, 2007 9:34 pm
Location: Central Maine
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 1300 with hopper
Coal Size/Type: Blaschak Anthracite Nut
Other Heating: Oil hot water radiators (fuel oil); propane

Post by rberq » Fri. Oct. 12, 2018 6:51 pm

KingCoal wrote:
Fri. Oct. 12, 2018 6:34 pm
RB, this one is real simple i'm sure you'll like it.
Now you have me thinking about the grill-work on the sides of my DS 1300. Considering replacing it with different grills that have much smaller holes, more closely approximating a solid piece of metal, but still a grill for the sake of appearance. Leaving a couple-inch gap at bottom and top, seems like it would significantly increase convection, but would it detrimentally reduce radiant heat?

 
KingCoal
Member
Posts: 4837
Joined: Wed. Apr. 03, 2013 1:24 pm
Location: Elkhart county, IN.
Hand Fed Coal Stove: 1 comforter stove works all iron coal box stove, seventies.
Baseburners & Antiques: 2014 DTS C17 Base Burner, GW #6, GW 113 formerly Sir Williams, maybe others at Pauliewog’s I’ve forgotten about
Coal Size/Type: Nut Anth.
Other Heating: none

Post by KingCoal » Sat. Oct. 20, 2018 3:32 pm

as you know i think the "stock" circulator design steals more radiant performance than it gives back in circulatory convection so you aren't really getting that much ( relatively speaking ) to start with.

sooo, doing just what you say would be the best way too get everything you can. my idea is pretty much the same with solid shrouds instead of perforated and the addition of a roll out of metal at the top to keep the air path from hitting the underside of the stove top and at best just getting forced to the floor.

instead it will get forced away from the stove in an upward arch making the convection loop wider and getting more warmth into the front entry and the dining room.

i'm playing with FRANK a little bit this afternoon. it's 43 with enough wind to feel like 32. the wind is pretty much constant at 25-35mpg. have the stove in base mode with 2 mpd's closed and the mano is rocking between -.01 and -.03 inside the combustion chamber although i just watched a gust push it -.09, then back.

nice to have the bi metal primary in stuff like this, it's holding the flap open about the width of an eyelash and keeping the house an even 70 IAT.

getting ready to go to PA next weekend so no time to bend any metal for the double heater shrouds till i get back.

steve


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