Cookin' With Coal

 
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Sunny Boy
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Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Thu. Mar. 24, 2022 3:57 pm

Yes, that's a wood grate. Can't be used for coal. And if you run it hot with wood and don't leave enough ash on the grate they warp rather easily. Then they can't be adjusted for under fire air.

Dana has said he can get the 7 to 6 tapered stove pipes. Added benefit t running it through the warming oven is it will help make it warmer.

Dane or Wilson may be able to set you up with a pair of triangular coal grates and the removable grate frame for them. Both do a lot of parts recasting for Glenwood ranges. If they can get you a set, but they don't have the special GW triangular grate crank handle, I have extras.

FYI get the grates before you make firebox bricks. The bricks have to fit into and sit on the top edge of the gate frame. Plus, not be too thick so they clear rotating the grates. The original GW range fireclay bricks were 3/4 inch thick.

Paul


 
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SteevB
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Hand Fed Coal Stove: Glenwood 208 Cabinet C w/ warming oven and gas side car
Other Heating: Forced hot air oil furnace, Tulikivi masonry heater Mom's house

Post by SteevB » Thu. Mar. 24, 2022 7:25 pm

That's a good point about the grates clearing the refractory. I hadn't thought about it before. I'll have to get some careful measurements on the existing grate and box when I head to Maine soon.

One thing I am not clear about even after reading the entire thread is whether all 208 C fire boxes and grate frame outer dimensions are the same or not. I'm thinking too about what you mentioned up-thread about 8" lids not always being truly 8" - that kind of thing.

The youngest casting date that I have found on the stove is 1926, but I suppose that could be a replacement part and the stove is older - or not.

I bought the gas side car directly from Bryant's before they closed, which was a year or so after I found the stove itself on Craigslist.

I found the water fronts shown in the catalog Dana (?) posted interesting too. I could never figure out why there is a 3rd pipe knockout on the firebox extension, but I now see in the catalog that at least one large water coil used that far hole. That seems like an awful lot of pipe in the firebox. I suppose a coal fire could withstand that kind of cooling above it, but wood probably not so much.

The house is a fairly small 1000 square foot, 1 1/2 story New England farm house. I am slowly going room to room, gutting to the studs, replacing all wiring and plumbing, doing spray foam for the full 4" stud depth, putting another 1" of rigid foam on top of that to cut stud bridging losses, then drywalling on top of that. The stone foundation got replaced some years before me with a poured concrete one, but I re-excavated it and put rigid foam on the outside. I'll be doing a full basement joist rim seal with foam as well. I'm sure I'll need to add a heat recovery ventilator when I'm done due to airtightness and that will probably need to be balanced to provide enough air for the stove. Primary automatic heat probably will be a mini-split heat pump, but if the stove can put a sizable dent in the now outrageously-priced electric consumption, all the better. The house heat now is hot air by oil. Aroostock County, Maine winters are serious business.

Thank you for all your helpful information, both today, and up-thread!

Steve

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25560
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Thu. Mar. 24, 2022 9:15 pm

No, not all 208 are the same. The different models used a three digit number system - the first two for features within a model name, and the last number was the cooktop round cover size. Simplest models were 108, then 208, 308, were mid line and 408 have more features. A 107 or 207 would have the same features within the model line, but with 7 inch round covers.

The model name denoted size. My Sunny and the Model F being the smallest, then the very common model C and a few other letter models are a mid size, then the model E and M are the largest, along with the top of the line, Home Grand model. Most if the size difference being in oven width - 18, 20, or 22 inch wide.

My 1903 Sunny Glenwood model is also a 208, but few of the parts would swap with other 208 of different model names. And not even in the same model name line as yearly changes were made. Such as my model name was used for many years, but the grates and fire bricks in it only fit 1903 and 1904 Sunny. Before and after that, GW made changes that prevent swapping most parts. However the cooktop plates are the same as used on later Sunnys and many model C that have a number ending in 8 - even later production than my range.

And the 8 is just a generalization. The round covers actually measure 8-1/2 inch diameter tat fit into a 8-3/4 inch recess formed by the top plates.

Yeah, model names and numbers, in the age before standardization became more popular, gets confusing ! :eh:

Glenwood offered a few different shape water fronts. And yours being a later range may have had more choices of pipe hook up?

That much square footage, and with it being so well insulated, you likely can heat the whole place with just the range. My small Sunny heats the back part of this 1891 uninsulated Victorian, which works out to about 1500 square feet of 7 rooms on two stories.

Paul

 
PlanelyFlyin
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Hand Fed Coal Stove: A cookstove of some kind in the future
Other Heating: Currently a Quadrafire 1200 pellet stove

Post by PlanelyFlyin » Sun. May. 08, 2022 1:04 am

Wow!!! This thread is the gold mine of information (with pictures!) I've been looking for about using a coal fired cookstove! I've been surprised at how little information there is in just a general internet search for trying to figure out coal and cookstoves, so thanks guys for keeping up with this, it's at least been really helpful to me. I've made it to page 25, so got a bit more reading to catch up on. It's also convincing me that the antique stove is the way I want to go rather than a modern built coal cookstove. I sat down with my husband the other day and went over everything I've been reading and learning, pros and cons for the different stoves, different coals, etc... Talking my head of with all the stuff I've learned and trying to figure out what would be the best decision. Finally he stopped me and asked, "but, which stove do you want to get". Well, the antique one of course. "Then lets just get it" he said. I love that guy! It might be a year or so before we can, since we're building an addition on our house right now, and that's project enough for one summer. But you all are convincing me that a coal fired antique cookstove needs to be in my future!
Alyssa

 
Hoytman
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Location: swOH near a little town where the homes are mobile and the cars aren’t
Hand Fed Coal Stove: Hitzer 354
Coal Size/Type: nut coal
Other Heating: electric, wood, oil

Post by Hoytman » Thu. Jun. 16, 2022 4:59 pm

Not sure if anyone had seen this and/or posted it. It’s a link about cooking on a wood stove, so maybe some of it will apply to cooking with a coal cookstove as well. Lots of good cooking info and recipes.

https://woodcookstovecooking.blogspot.com/?m=0

 
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jedneck
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Location: South Central PA
Hand Fed Coal Stove: DSM Antramax
Baseburners & Antiques: Florin 20-12, red cross oak double heater, 3 columbians a epoch, emblem and palace
Coal Size/Type: nut or stove
Other Heating: Southbend Banner range

Post by jedneck » Sun. Oct. 09, 2022 7:43 pm

:clap: :clap: back to having an overpriced propain serving center. Maybe I’ll gain a few pounds now that i can actually cook.

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25560
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Fri. Nov. 11, 2022 11:27 am

Hoytman wrote:
Thu. Jun. 16, 2022 4:59 pm
Not sure if anyone had seen this and/or posted it. It’s a link about cooking on a wood stove, so maybe some of it will apply to cooking with a coal cookstove as well. Lots of good cooking info and recipes.

https://woodcookstovecooking.blogspot.com/?m=0

Yes, that site was mentioned in these threads, but I see he has a lot more posted since then. A very interesting site.

And if I remember, somewhere in his posts he gives a nod to this coal thread. ;)

Paul


 
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Sunny Boy
Member
Posts: 25560
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Fri. Nov. 11, 2022 11:28 am

jedneck wrote:
Sun. Oct. 09, 2022 7:43 pm
:clap: :clap: back to having an overpriced propain serving center. Maybe I’ll gain a few pounds now that i can actually cook.
The fun of cooking on an old range is not good for a diet. :lol:

Paul

 
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Post by gardener » Wed. Dec. 28, 2022 10:36 am

reading a book from the early 20th century about kitchen efficiency

under the section heading TIME AND LABOR-SAVING EQUIPMENT
Every woman knows that there are two things that make cooking tedious and confining. First the waiting around for things to cook after the actual work of preparation has been done, as in "watching up" the cooking of pot-roasts, stews, etc. Second the necessity of cooking at an inconvenient time in order to economize fuel. This is always a problem with a coal range, and must be carefully considered in the use of a gas oven.
I am not able to comprehend the this passage and hoping someone might be able to explain it to me. Especially the part about 'cooking at an inconventient time in order to economize fuel' in regards to 'problem with a coal range' or 'use of a gas oven'. The only thing I can think of so far is because she says 'gas oven' perhaps it is in reference to monitoring the progress of the food that is cooking because the oven temperature was not known??? or at least for people that did not have ranges with thermometers. However in this chapter she is talking about various fireless cookers and steamers, maybe it is in reference to needing to prepare and initially heat the food early enough so that it will be done cooking by the time it needs to be served... maybe thats why she mentions pot-roasts and stews as examples?

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25560
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Wed. Dec. 28, 2022 10:59 am

gardener wrote:
Wed. Dec. 28, 2022 10:36 am
reading a book from the early 20th century about kitchen efficiency

under the section heading TIME AND LABOR-SAVING EQUIPMENT


I am not able to comprehend the this passage and hoping someone might be able to explain it to me. Especially the part about 'cooking at an inconventient time in order to economize fuel' in regards to 'problem with a coal range' or 'use of a gas oven'. The only thing I can think of so far is because she says 'gas oven' perhaps it is in reference to monitoring the progress of the food that is cooking because the oven temperature was not known??? or at least for people that did not have ranges with thermometers. However in this chapter she is talking about various fireless cookers and steamers, maybe it is in reference to needing to prepare and initially heat the food early enough so that it will be done cooking by the time it needs to be served... maybe thats why she mentions pot-roasts and stews as examples?
........ the necessity of cooking at an inconvenient time in order to economize fuel. ....."

Not sure what she means by this. In all the years we've been using a coal oven, I can't think of any situation where we had to run the oven at an "inconvenient time" to save fuel.

Except while starting or refueling the firebed, the oven is always left "on". When it comes time to use the oven, it's just a matter of adjusting dampers to get the oven temps needed. Most of the time the oven is at the perfect temps for slow baking meats without need of preheating - like is needed with a gas oven.

And if you don't run with the oven "on" (indirect mode) you waste heat up the chimney by being in direct draft.

I think maybe she is draft daft. :lol:

Paul

 
PlanelyFlyin
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Post by PlanelyFlyin » Wed. Dec. 28, 2022 11:41 am

gardener wrote:
Wed. Dec. 28, 2022 10:36 am
reading a book from the early 20th century about kitchen efficiency

under the section heading TIME AND LABOR-SAVING EQUIPMENT


I am not able to comprehend the this passage and hoping someone might be able to explain it to me. Especially the part about 'cooking at an inconventient time in order to economize fuel' in regards to 'problem with a coal range' or 'use of a gas oven'. The only thing I can think of so far is because she says 'gas oven' perhaps it is in reference to monitoring the progress of the food that is cooking because the oven temperature was not known??? or at least for people that did not have ranges with thermometers. However in this chapter she is talking about various fireless cookers and steamers, maybe it is in reference to needing to prepare and initially heat the food early enough so that it will be done cooking by the time it needs to be served... maybe thats why she mentions pot-roasts and stews as examples?
She mentions "watching up" when cooking pot roasts and similar. I know that when my husband is slow cooking a brisket, ribs, etc... on the smoker he has to "babysit" it to make sure it stays at an even temperature using added charcoal or damper adjustments. Not having cooked with a coal cookstove yet I don't know if that would be an accurate comparison, but I don't imagine that it's as fix-it-and-forget-it as a modern electric and gas stove is.
On the mention of having to economize fuel, is a coal cookstove hottest when you first load it? If it is then maybe she is talking of having to do any cooking that requires really hot temps (such as searing your roast) when you first load the stove in the morning. Another thought, was coal rationed during the war? If it was then it might be reference to that maybe?

 
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Post by gardener » Mon. Jan. 09, 2023 10:33 am

Thanks Paul and PlanelyFlyin

> Another thought, was coal rationed during the war

The book was written sometime in the 1910s, I thought I saw a publication year of 1916.

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25560
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Mon. Jan. 09, 2023 12:42 pm

PlanelyFlyin wrote:
Wed. Dec. 28, 2022 11:41 am
She mentions "watching up" when cooking pot roasts and similar. I know that when my husband is slow cooking a brisket, ribs, etc... on the smoker he has to "babysit" it to make sure it stays at an even temperature using added charcoal or damper adjustments. Not having cooked with a coal cookstove yet I don't know if that would be an accurate comparison, but I don't imagine that it's as fix-it-and-forget-it as a modern electric and gas stove is.
On the mention of having to economize fuel, is a coal cookstove hottest when you first load it? If it is then maybe she is talking of having to do any cooking that requires really hot temps (such as searing your roast) when you first load the stove in the morning. Another thought, was coal rationed during the war? If it was then it might be reference to that maybe?
Yes, when first starting a firebed there is more fresh fuel burning so a greater volume of heat going to the oven equals higher oven temps.

But we don't wait until a fresh firebed to do roasts, we do them whenever we wish. Melissa sears the roasts in a Dutch oven on the stove top then adds all the veggies and liquid and puts it in the oven.

If you don't let the firebed run low and ash-up, it's very easy to get the oven into the mid to upper 300F range without pushing the range, so slow-cooking meats at lower temps is very easy. With the range just idling along, oven temps in the mid 200F are normal. And if you want to use the oven for slow cooking you can set the dampers tighter so that it will maintain crockpot temps for about 12 hours.

With coal, there is no need to babysit the oven either. As long as you have fed the firebed and shaken ash, then set the dampers to get the oven temp desired, it will provide a stable temperature for many hours.

However, if using wood, then yes, you'd have to baby sit the oven temps because wood will not provide a stable oven temp for anywhere near as long as coal will.

And a plus to having a coal range is that, with the long internal flues and so much heat radiating surface area, a coal range can extract more heat from every pound of coal than even the best base heaters. I have one of the best base heaters, a Glenwood #6, and it can't come near to extracting heat as well as my small Sunny Glenwood.

And running it on wood is not as practical because those long flues are tough to clean creosote out of. Been there, won't go back. ;)

Paul

 
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Sunny Boy
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Posts: 25560
Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
Location: Central NY
Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace

Post by Sunny Boy » Sun. Jan. 22, 2023 4:58 pm

Japanese cookin' with coal on a train. Would you like your squid medium or well done ? :D



Paul

 
Hoytman
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Other Heating: electric, wood, oil

Post by Hoytman » Mon. Jan. 30, 2023 2:22 pm

Hey Paul,
Does a Modern Glenwood F ring a bell?

I seen a cookstove the other day...can't exactly recall the type on the door. It was a real small Glenwood cookstove...about the width of a nice wood burning stove.

If that name is correct, would that stove be larger or smaller than your Sunny Glenwood?

Just trying to gauge a stove for my 1350 sq ft. The more I think about a cook stove the more I like the thought of it. I think it could benefit us in so many ways. Propane use 6 months out of the year being one factor...and my tank has already lasted me 5+ years with 15% left in the tank. Obviously, my propane doesn't cost me much already, but it would cost me even less.

The biggest benefit are the many other features you've listed in this thread...and I don't really want to take time to re-read all 197 pages, but I just think it would work out great.


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