Manual Pipe Dampers .. How, Why, When

Modern and vintage hand fired coal stove are similar to a wood stove and in some cases can burn either. They need to be regulated and fed by hand usually every 12 to 24 hours depending on your usage. They require no power to operate making them ideal for rural settings with long power outages.
RMA
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Post Sun. Feb. 14, 2010 12:22 pm

My stove has a 4.75" exhaust with a manual damper, as equipped by the factory "Haas & Sohn".
The damper consists of a cast iron flange with a cast disc loosely fitted to the throat. The disc
has a 25% cutout and perhaps 1/8" or so around its periphery to allow for the passage of flue gases
even in the "full-closed" position. Additionally I have a 5" barometric damper just downstream from the manual damper and immediately before a 5" to 6" adapter then to the SS chimney insert...to a 6"x9' inch tiled masonry flue, internal to the house. The chimney rises approximately 25'...My stove fits nicely on the existing hearth with an apron.

I have settled upon running the stove with the manual damper closed and the barometric damper adjusted to .05" water
(according to the Dwyer Magnahelic Gauge) this seems to give the most controlled burn with the good heat retention.
I was surprised to find that the stove ran better with the manual damper closed.

Bob

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HanSoSlow
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Post Thu. Apr. 29, 2010 1:52 pm

OK I just read every post here and still have questions.

I'm getting a Harman SF-150 and one of the most recent posts said that with wood it will not last all night?? Why not? Every stove Ihave had since I was a kid lasted all night and all but one used a MPD - just wondering why.

So, in the spring and fall when I'm burning wood I should use a MPD to control the fire and not over-fire the stove? then come winter and switching to coal use the baro?

I do not know the draft of the chimney, but when I use my Harman exception wood stove and do not close the damper (built in) the stove would probably melt. I could easily hit stack temps over 900 within 10 minutes - I'm not kidding did that once and it cost me $500 in new parts for the stove. I forgot it while I was getting the kids on the bus.

I was planning to use a MPD for wood burning, but now I'm not sure.

So what do I need??????? I'm so confused now.

I do have 2 CO's and will add more. 1 in each of the kids rooms since their rooms are right above the stove.

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Coalfire
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Hand Fed Coal Stove: DS Machine 96K btu Circulator
Coal Size/Type: Nut
Location: Denver, PA

Post Sat. May. 01, 2010 8:57 am

Hi HanSoSlow,
When I had my gibralter I alway used a baro(but I only ever burned coal), when I got my new DS Machine hand fed the factory told me to use a MPD. This was new to me so I asked some questions. Now what I am gonna say is what the maker of my stove reccomends, each manufacture is differant so check your owners manual. DS Machine said they use the MPD and it works extremely well. he claimed you don't need that much air flow out with coal and once the fire was going, and after refueling and the gasses burned off to close it completely. Even when it is closed it is not really closed with the holes in the plate and the gap around the side. He said unless people have a manometer they normally don't set up a baro well enough and lose heat up the chimney. That is another point if you don't know your dratf you really need a manometer, to set up a baro properly. I asked him if I could run both and he said that is the best(now bear in mind this is for there stove again). So that is what I did. I have the stove, mpd, baro, then up the chimney. I must say it works extremely well I can feel more heat when the MPD is closed. I got my stove at the end of the season, so I was not really burning it to hot, more of a low fire, and after reading all the posts in this section I thought I am going to do a little experiment. So now I have a test port before the baro and one before the MPD. Out door temps were in the high 50's I checked my draft before the baro (with the mpd open and closed made a negligable differance) and it was -.06, Now I checked it before the the MPD and it was still -.06. This was interersting. This went with what they said at DS Machine. Now Like I said that was on a lower fire, this comming winter when it is really cranking I will retest and repost my results, I expect with the larger fire and more combustion gases comming off there may be a slight drop, but I doubt it will be much. The baro keeps your draft constant which is really nice, and the MPD keeps heat in the fire box. So I guess now I am for having both of them :) if your manufacture alows. If you want to burn wood then wire the baro shut until you are ready for coal. The thing with the baro is if you have a chimney fire it will open more and add more fuel to the fire. I would put both in and use both(if you can)or only use the one that your manufacture recommeds for the fuel your burning at the time. I hope some of this helps these are just my experinces, and remember check with your manufacture for proper operation.
Have a great day, Eric

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coaledsweat
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Coal Size/Type: Pea
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Post Sat. May. 01, 2010 6:14 pm

Coalfire wrote:Out door temps were in the high 50's I checked my draft before the baro (with the mpd open and closed made a negligable differance) and it was -.06, Now I checked it before the the MPD and it was still -.06. This was interersting.
Where MPD players need to be careful is with a forced draft appliance. Your stack #s may look real nice, but in some cases, they and particularly the firebox may go to positive pressure draft when the blower is running.
Nothing is impossible for people who don't have to do it themselves.

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rsck
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Hand Fed Coal Stove: Atlantic Silvermoon, Plymouth,
Coal Size/Type: Nut, Pea, Lump
Location: Noonan, New Brunswick, Canada
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Post Fri. May. 21, 2010 7:55 pm

I have been tending fires for 20 years. I have always seen used and used my self Manual Pipe Dampers. My grand parents on their air tight stove even had a manual pipe damper. At my house I have used a manual pipe damper on wood stoves and furnaces. I also have a manual pipe damper on my coal stove. I have actually noticed less ash buildup in my chimneys over the years compared to friends that have baro or no damper. I burn less fuel as well. Baros are ok in some circumstances but I would never use one unless I had a manual pipe damper in line.
Randy

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2001Sierra
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Hot Air Coal Stoker Stove: Keystoker 90 Chimney vent
Coal Size/Type: Rice
Other Heating: Buderus Oil Boiler 3115-34
Stove/Furnace Model: Keystoker 90 Chimney Vent
Location: Wynantskill NY, 10 miles from Albany

Post Fri. May. 21, 2010 8:45 pm

I ran a Buderus hand fed for 27 years with no damper whatsoever. The bimetalic draft control on the stove managed everything. I now have a Keystoker 90 top vent stoker with a barometric damper dialed in as advised. Both stoves performed very well. The Keystoker is far less work with a wider burn time due to it's controls and the Coal-trol.

buck24
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Hand Fed Coal Stove: New Buck Corp. / MODEL 24 COAL
Coal Size/Type: Pea, Nut / Anthracite
Location: NEPA/Pittston Twp. PA

Post Tue. May. 25, 2010 11:00 pm

I, also am in favor of using a Manual Pipe Damper on a Handfired Coal Stove. I used one for 29 years with the Warm Morning stove and presently using one with the Buck Model 24 Coal Stove. In my opinion, when you get use to the Manual Pipe Damper it seems you can fine tune the burn of your stove a little bit better. Also, I get more heat out of the stove and less wasted heat out the chimney. I can really notice the difference with the MPD.

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freetown fred
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Hand Fed Coal Stove: HITZER 50-93
Coal Size/Type: BLASCHAK Nut
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Post Wed. May. 26, 2010 7:19 am

I agree w/buck24--I use a MPD on my hand fired Hitzer--after reading many posts I called Hitzer & spoke w/ a couple shop guys who use nothing damper wise I decided to stick w/ what I have experience with--I kept my MPD about 2/3 closed all winter & on shut down & clean up last week,noticed that there was very little fly ash above the damper--if it ain't broke,don't fix it--I keep saying--a stove is like a good woman,find out what she likes & stick with it :)
"A people that values it's privileges above it's principals, soon loses both"--Dwight D Eisenhower

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grumpy
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Post Thu. Jul. 15, 2010 8:20 pm

This is the most confusing subject on this board..lol

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JB Sparks
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Stove/Furnace Make: Harman - Chubby
Stove/Furnace Model: Harman: SF160 - Chubby Sr.
Location: north central Mass.

Post Thu. Jul. 15, 2010 8:46 pm

grumpy wrote:This is the most confusing subject on this board..lol
You're right, the Chubby comes with a MPD built right into the flue breach and the Harman manual strongly recommends not using one. I guess it comes down to "what ever works".

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grumpy
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Post Thu. Jul. 15, 2010 8:53 pm

I am planing to burn coal this year in my old Florance, I am just worried about an over fire if the winds pick up and I'm not paying attention. I also burn wood so a baro is not wanted. I could put one in and cap it for wood I suppose but the thing is 50 people will tell me I should have a Baro and 50 people will tell I do not need one.... :cry: :cry: :cry:

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JB Sparks
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Stove/Furnace Make: Harman - Chubby
Stove/Furnace Model: Harman: SF160 - Chubby Sr.
Location: north central Mass.

Post Thu. Jul. 15, 2010 9:10 pm

Well, since you're burning wood too, I would forget about the baro and install the MPD. I have both on my Chubby and with the MPD closed about 2/3 the baro only moves when it's windy out. I suppose 50 people will agree and 50 people won't. What ever floats your boat. :D

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grumpy
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Post Thu. Jul. 15, 2010 9:29 pm

LOL.... Thing is I don't think there were Baro's when my stove was bulit,, 1914 ...

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JB Sparks
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Stove/Furnace Make: Harman - Chubby
Stove/Furnace Model: Harman: SF160 - Chubby Sr.
Location: north central Mass.

Post Thu. Jul. 15, 2010 9:39 pm

Bottom line... you burn wood in your stove so, no baro. MPD for control.

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grumpy
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Post Thu. Jul. 15, 2010 9:45 pm

Yeah I think so, looking forward to it too..

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