Tesla Roadster 0-60 in 1.1 seconds
That is nearly twice as fast as any current vehicle...0 to 1/4 mile in 8.88 seconds....
https://hypebeast.com/2021/5/tesla-roadster-space ... nfirmation
Not many vehicles can even achieve 2 seconds.... in street legal form
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Roadster_(sec ... eneration)
BigBarney
https://hypebeast.com/2021/5/tesla-roadster-space ... nfirmation
Not many vehicles can even achieve 2 seconds.... in street legal form
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Roadster_(sec ... eneration)
BigBarney
-
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 11417
- Joined: Wed. Nov. 05, 2008 5:11 pm
- Location: Kent CT
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: V ermont Castings 2310, Franco Belge 262
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood Modern Oak 114
- Coal Size/Type: nut and pea
How is this a desirable thing? I wonder how long the running gear will take that kind of torque.BigBarney wrote: ↑Mon. May. 24, 2021 12:08 pmThat is nearly twice as fast as any current vehicle...0 to 1/4 mile in 8.88 seconds....
https://hypebeast.com/2021/5/tesla-roadster-space ... nfirmation
Not many vehicles can even achieve 2 seconds.... in street legal form
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Roadster_(sec ... eneration)
BigBarney
- warminmn
- Member
- Posts: 8208
- Joined: Tue. Feb. 08, 2011 5:59 pm
- Location: Land of 11,842 lakes
- Hand Fed Coal Stove: Chubby Junior, Riteway 37
- Coal Size/Type: nut and stove anthracite, lignite
- Other Heating: Wood and wear a wool shirt
Would be awful fun (while grinning ear to ear) to take for a quick fast ride, but impractical for daily needs to have that much takeoff. I cant imagine letting a teenager drive that as yes, they will floor it. Power=danger with a young person.
-
- Member
- Posts: 5791
- Joined: Sun. Feb. 17, 2008 1:08 pm
- Location: Harrison, Tenn
- Other Heating: Wishing it was cold enough for coal here....not really
Sort of like owning one of the high tech machine guns that us normal people can't afford. One off wonder that does not translate to the public.
Kevin
Not to mention the likelihood of it catching fire.....
Kevin
Not to mention the likelihood of it catching fire.....
- CoalisCoolxWarm
- Member
- Posts: 2323
- Joined: Wed. Jan. 19, 2011 11:41 am
- Location: Western PA
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KA-6
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: old Sears rebuilt, bituminous- offline as of winter 2014
- Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Buckwheat
- Other Heating: Oil Boiler
Wonder what the diesel-generated electric usage is? Compared to mpg fuel
- CoalisCoolxWarm
- Member
- Posts: 2323
- Joined: Wed. Jan. 19, 2011 11:41 am
- Location: Western PA
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KA-6
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: old Sears rebuilt, bituminous- offline as of winter 2014
- Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Buckwheat
- Other Heating: Oil Boiler
Yep, we know (resistance) electricity is the least efficient method of heating. How much fossil fuel does it take to generate the electricity needed to power one of these things?
- Richard S.
- Mayor
- Posts: 15262
- Joined: Fri. Oct. 01, 2004 8:35 pm
- Location: NEPA
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
- Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/Anthracite
Efficiency is available energy minus what is not utilized, for example heat going out the chimney. Electric heat is 100% efficient at least at the point of heating, all of the available energy is converted to heat. It's the initial cost per BTU that eats your lunch.CoalisCoolxWarm wrote: ↑Tue. May. 25, 2021 2:30 pmYep, we know (resistance) electricity is the least efficient method of heating.
As far as cars goes gasoline engines are notoriously inefficient. All that heat lost through the radiator and exhaust pipe is inefficiency, about 30% efficient at best in modern car. Most of the available energy is lost to heat production. Electric vehicles are much higher in the 75% range, most of tha aviable power is moving the car forward. This is one of the reasons they can be so damn fast.
With that said the efficiency hit for electric is production. The newest combined cycle gas plants are only at about 60% at optimal operation when they are run at full capacity. That is best case and only happens at base load plants or during peak demand. There is also losses in transmission. This inefficiency makes these nitwits banning gas heat/stoves look like nitwits because they are actually increasing emissions.
These comparisons get complicated because if you are going to account for production/transmission loss for electric you would have to account for energy expense of transporting fuel , etc.
- CoalisCoolxWarm
- Member
- Posts: 2323
- Joined: Wed. Jan. 19, 2011 11:41 am
- Location: Western PA
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Keystoker KA-6
- Hand Fed Coal Furnace: old Sears rebuilt, bituminous- offline as of winter 2014
- Coal Size/Type: Anthracite Buckwheat
- Other Heating: Oil Boiler
You're right about the comparisons getting complicated- at least to communicate.
There is no "direct" production of electricity into usable format. Even solar must go to battery to aggregate before being used (save the prototype 2lb cars)
I guess the thing to consider is how much carbon fuels are required to make the electricity required, and somehow equate that to a comparable "mpg"
How to best do that? Uhm...let me get my slide rule
There is no "direct" production of electricity into usable format. Even solar must go to battery to aggregate before being used (save the prototype 2lb cars)
I guess the thing to consider is how much carbon fuels are required to make the electricity required, and somehow equate that to a comparable "mpg"
How to best do that? Uhm...let me get my slide rule
- Sunny Boy
- Member
- Posts: 25754
- Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
- Location: Central NY
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
- Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
- Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
In major areas where EV's would stand a chance of being practical, there isn't enough electric generation capacity now. You only have to wake up and look at what California has been dealing with for many years and it gets worse every year. I have family out there in central and northern Cali, so I get to hear the everyday living with it version, not the sugar-coated, political/media version.
So expect electric cost increases - EV owner or not - as the power companies try catch-up expanding the grid. Plus, with the electric suppliers switching from cheap fuels to more expensive, costs of EV are going to take another hit.
And now more than 20 years on, EV's are still not practical in most of "fly-over country". And with how fast technology advances, that's a real sad showing when 100 years ago the ICE engines had replaced most of the horse powered transportation.
Paul
So expect electric cost increases - EV owner or not - as the power companies try catch-up expanding the grid. Plus, with the electric suppliers switching from cheap fuels to more expensive, costs of EV are going to take another hit.
And now more than 20 years on, EV's are still not practical in most of "fly-over country". And with how fast technology advances, that's a real sad showing when 100 years ago the ICE engines had replaced most of the horse powered transportation.
Paul
Attachments
- Richard S.
- Mayor
- Posts: 15262
- Joined: Fri. Oct. 01, 2004 8:35 pm
- Location: NEPA
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
- Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/Anthracite
A lot of those vehicles will be charged at night when there is plenty of capacity. In fact it's been suggested all these batteries can help supplement the grid. Charge at night when there is plenty of excess capacity and the electric is cheap, siphon it off for the house when you hit peak demand and the cost of power is the most, as long as you aren't using the car of course.
If you look at the history of the automobile it goes back to the late 1700's with steam powered ones. Between that time and the model T there was very long development of different types including diesel, steam, electric and of course gas. The model T is the defining moment because it made cars cheap, the technology was already available. What is really interesting about gas is that it was considered waste product of refining kerosene. It's a great example of having a waste product in high supply that someone developed a technology to use.And now more than 20 years on, EV's are still not practical in most of "fly-over country". And with how fast technology advances, that's a real sad showing when 100 years ago the ICE engines had replaced most of the horse powered transportation.
It will take quite a while before gas is fully replaced by battery operated. The battery tech still needs significant improvement and the infrastructure to charge them like you have gasoline stations will take a long time to develop. One thing to keep in mind is you don't know what tech is around the corner, there is company predicting they will have commercially viable fusion reactor in 10 years. If that occurs fossil fuels days are severely limited.
-
- Member
- Posts: 5791
- Joined: Sun. Feb. 17, 2008 1:08 pm
- Location: Harrison, Tenn
- Other Heating: Wishing it was cold enough for coal here....not really
If you are generating with solar and wind, there is no surplus at night and if everyone has an EV, then there is never a time when power is "off peak" because they all charge at night.....it is a circular fool show.
Kevin
Kevin
- Richard S.
- Mayor
- Posts: 15262
- Joined: Fri. Oct. 01, 2004 8:35 pm
- Location: NEPA
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
- Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/Anthracite
The difference is you are utilizing an under utilized resource, ironically it could lower the cost of power. The least costly plants to run are base load running at or near capacity 24/7. The capital investment is fully utilized and they are running at optimal efficiency.
What's interesting about battery storage is that it is more applicable to conventional plants. You have intermediate and peaking plants and the cost of the power from those plants is extraordinarily high. A small amount of battery storage to act as a buffer will be less costly than building those plants. The intermediate plants can be run at full capacity and the peaking plants mothballed. As the demand increases moth balled plants can be brought back online. Net result is your capacity has increased dramatically with a small investment in battery storage.
- Sunny Boy
- Member
- Posts: 25754
- Joined: Mon. Nov. 11, 2013 1:40 pm
- Location: Central NY
- Hand Fed Coal Boiler: Anthracite Industrial, domestic hot water heater
- Baseburners & Antiques: Glenwood range 208, # 6 base heater, 2 Modern Oak 118.
- Coal Size/Type: Nuts !
- Other Heating: Oil &electric plenum furnace
The automobile does not go back to 1700. That's a false argument because steam did not replace horse-drawn transportation for individuals. It only worked in trains, ships, and some agriculture and construction. It was never viable for personal transportation because it took too long to get the vehicle "up to steam". Just ask any owner of a White or Stanley Steamer. I have, because I have friends and customers that collect and drive them at shows. And unlike ICE engine antique cars, they never drive them TO a show, always having to trailer them, because steam cars never had the range of an ICE, even of the same vintage. Sound familiar ?Richard S. wrote: ↑Wed. May. 26, 2021 11:13 amA lot of those vehicles will be charged at night when there is plenty of capacity. In fact it's been suggested all these batteries can help supplement the grid. Charge at night when there is plenty of excess capacity and the electric is cheap, siphon it off for the house when you hit peak demand and the cost of power is the most, as long as you aren't using the car of course.
If you look at the history of the automobile it goes back to the late 1700's with steam powered ones. Between that time and the model T there was very long development of different types including diesel, steam, electric and of course gas. The model T is the defining moment because it made cars cheap, the technology was already available. What is really interesting about gas is that it was considered waste product of refining kerosene. It's a great example of having a waste product in high supply that someone developed a technology to use.
It will take quite a while before gas is fully replaced by battery operated. The battery tech still needs significant improvement and the infrastructure to charge them like you have gasoline stations will take a long time to develop. One thing to keep in mind is you don't know what tech is around the corner, there is company predicting they will have commercially viable fusion reactor in 10 years. If that occurs fossil fuels days are severely limited.
And to further the falsity of 1700 steam car argument, we're talking about motorized personal transportation, and that didn't really start until after 1900 as the internal combustion engine proved far superior to steam and electric cars way back then. By 1920, cars with ICE engines ( and commercial transport) were well established with thousands of automakers competing. The Automotive Historians Society estimates there were over 5000 different makes of automobiles by WWII. Almost every carriage and wagon maker, such as Studebaker, and local blacksmith shop, made some type of automobile in an effort to stay in business as horse-drawn vehicles were fading out quickly in the early 1900s.
Paul
- Richard S.
- Mayor
- Posts: 15262
- Joined: Fri. Oct. 01, 2004 8:35 pm
- Location: NEPA
- Stoker Coal Boiler: Van Wert VA1200
- Coal Size/Type: Buckwheat/Anthracite
Surely it does if we are talking about development. As far as gasoline the first one predates the model T by more than 2 decades.
The technology is here, while it can't fully replace gas/diesel there is a demand for it and that technology will only improve. It's going to take a significant chunk of the market.