Coalpail.com Forum

snuffy's got it figured...

Look at the santa bags close...
It is not a sealed bag...
Holes let air out so the bags don't pop when piled on the pallet...
Those same holes let water in when stored outside...
The wrap is meant to keep the pallet of bags from moving...
Not to keep water out...
Once the water gets in it stays in because the plastic keeps the majority of the water in...
Unlike the woven bags...

Thanks for the great summary. I think that says it all.

Man, I'm really sorry about the adversarial relationship, and thanks to Snuffy for the short answer. We all need to work together on issues, and perhaps that is why I should pick any battle more carefully. Stating the obvious isn't 'so obvious'.

I have been covered in 'black rain, too. I am not happy when it occurs. It is a REAL reason it can be hard to convince anyone to burn bagged. I had bulk for 37 years, so I'm in a whole different world, but in the last two years I been playing with Surdiacs, Franco, Alaska's, Glenwoods, Warm Morning, Jotol....all the heavy ones. No box burners yet.

waitin' for a snow storm, hoping it misses..............

snuffy wrote:Let me offer another possible explanation for the wet bagged coal. Any material wrapped in plastic will hasten evaporation. Changing temperatures and ambient humidity will cause condensation to form in an enclosed environment. Coal or many other natural materials don't change temps as quickly as air temp. Bagged coal or for that matter, bagged salt, will trap and gather more and more moisture, especially if it was exposed to summer and fall heating/cooling and humidity cycles.

The solution would be to open the bags a few days before using it and letting it air dry or buy winter bagged coal due to drier winter air. Hope this helps.

I agree. I burned 1 pallet of Blaschak last season. My dealer hauls Blaschak and Kimmels in enclosed trailers and is stored indoors. The Blaschak coal was a little wet but not seeping. Kimmels on the other hand oozes yellow stuff and is very wet. I have a pair of pants and a sweatshirt that are permanently stained now.

I too have seen wet Kimmel. At one time it was it was very bad. The difference is the woven bags are more conducive to air drying. I think the real solution is to buy in bulk since we have no control over how it is stored at the dealers location. When I bought pea in bulk I never had water issues regardless of the coal brand. Of course rice is probably more susceptible than pea or nut to moisture issues due to a higher surface area.

snuffy wrote:Let me offer another possible explanation for the wet bagged coal. Any material wrapped in plastic will hasten evaporation. Changing temperatures and ambient humidity will cause condensation to form in an enclosed environment. Coal or many other natural materials don't change temps as quickly as air temp. Bagged coal or for that matter, bagged salt, will trap and gather more and more moisture, especially if it was exposed to summer and fall heating/cooling and humidity cycles.

The solution would be to open the bags a few days before using it and letting it air dry or buy winter bagged coal due to drier winter air. Hope this helps.

I think you solved the mystery. I deliver bagged and wrapped Sackrete products and have seen problems with wet bags if the product is too hot before bagging. We run the sand & stone through a huge oil fired dryer before bagging to remove moisture. If the sand & stone is not cooled enough, condensation will form under the top sheet of the pallet and drip on the top layer of bags. So if the coal is heated in the drying process this same thing may be happening with the pallets. Maybe Whistlenut could confirm this the next time he visits his buds at the plant.

Good idea! 4 inches here, huge flakes.....lots of skidding and sliding accidents......from all the water drizzling out of the bagged coal on the road......
I think that the condensation issue is possible, but that would not be anything substantial. I will keep you posted.

As has been mentioned, stoker folks don't experience the bagged coal issues. It comes in a 40 footer, gets dumped, drys out there, is dumped in a big bin, case closed.

It isn't worth the fight, I am going to let you all think what you want to think.....sorry for the aggravation I caused.
Sometimes people can't ever see the forest, the damned trees are in the way !!!

Next time you might want to ask the trucker and the mine to make sure the trailer is raised to drain the water before it goes on the scale. Excess water in the coal is one of my pet peeves, and the truckers and mines I've dealt with have been very cooperative on this.

Mike

P.S. Sorry, whistlenut, but I've had the same problem with soaking wet Blaschak bags that others have described.

coalmeister wrote:My 2 cents... The driver that delivered my 23 tons of Summit coal said most coal is washed. In fact they credited me for 1200 pounds of water. The water was running out the back of the truck as he was driving in and I had giant puddles on the tarp for weeks

I hear you Pacony. I don't know more than what I've seen first hand.
Here is some logic we are all aware of however: If the coal were wet at the bagging plant, the amount of handling surely causes fines to be created...everyone will be on board the Ozzie Express so far.

If that were true, do you suppose multi-million dollar processing machinery would not get all caked with fines; dust, etc. IF that is accepted, then how the hell could this expensive equipment last a week without being all gummed up, seized up or otherwise destroyed????????

Having noted that.....and we are all following Ozzie on the road to Cleveland....why did I see, hear, and experience the knife style blower systems similar to a massive car wash? The blowers MUST make sure the coal is dry for processing, otherwise it would not be cost effective to be in the bagging business. The bags do have dozens of small air relief holes someplace around Santa's chubby body, but there is no water.

Everyone should know coal is washed several times to get off extraneous crud, but that is long before bagging.
I have been spooged all over with good clothes on and was VERY POed.
It wasn't Blashak, but one of the other large bagged delivery folks.
Also, later in the year, I had some Blashak coal that was dry as a bone...and just last month picked up 3 tons of bagged rice from a happy homeowner who had gone to corn. 136 bags, no moisture....no broken bags. All I know is what I see...but I damned sure don't wear the tighty whities if I'm working with bagged coal, either. It's hard on the arms carrying the stuff fully extended...makes the back even sorer! .....so I just draw it close to the chest and limp along....trying not to make any waves and smile at everyone.

News Flash: I mentioned that Stroker Scotty has developed an A-Dust hot rod golf cart for 'Gated Community Folks' in Southern Climates and after an initial trial with wet bagged coal failed, he tried again with Blashak Bagged Coal and found a moisture content of 0.35 for the very first time! This Golf Cart is categorized in the Top Fossil Fuel Category and is available in a Female version only. 'Zero to Incendiary Bitch' in 4.56 seconds...all in the length of Gated Community Driveway! Thanks to Stroker Stoker for providing a much needed avenue of relief for our special partners! Three cheers!

whistlenut wrote:'Zero to Incendiary Bitch' in 4.56 seconds...

My Lord!! He's cloned my ex-girlfriend!

You gotta figure how many times the coal changes hands when it leaves the plant. Rattling in a truck for hours, bounced all over by the teenage rookie on the forklift, loaded into your vehicle & bounced all the way home, then hand loaded & stacked not-so-gently in your coal spot. It's easy to see how fines form.

Same deal with the moisture too -- different temps, humidity levels, wind-driven rain on the back of a flatbed, sitting outside on pallets in wind & torrential downpours ......

I think it would have to come in hermetically sealed bags in order to arrive moisture free.

Thank you Smitty. We have to be Republicans, no f**ing way two democrats could agree on the obvious.......
I think some of the less abused body types, who are coal users, have little grasp on what it takes to make things happen in the real world. It is painful, not every day, but most days.
Unfortunately we aren't perfect, but we sure do care about what we do, and don't 'jack our jaws' all day when a single hair is out of place. Deal with it McGiver!

I sure wish people would at least read the name on the bag and copy it when the bad words start: It's Blashak...it's what's for winter! Unless you are Superior, and that is a statement of fact. Jeddo, UAE, Kimmels, Lenig's ( all three of them).
It's a dirty job, but as we sit here with a comfortable home and or garage/workshop or ...errrrrrr Man Cave!
That is a very sexist term.....indication you are a club wielding, hair dragging dinosaur from the past.....who has respect for nothing. Feel good about that tag hangin' round your neck? Do you have a daughter? A wife? Many girlfriends plus a wife? (Hi Tiger!, how's that working out for ya?) Marital funds disallution....5 mil today, 22 mil on Sunday, 156 Mil in a few years.
It is painful isn't it smitty? Zero to incendiary in 4.5 seconds....only time to say: OOOOHHHHHH SSSSSSSSS!
DUCK, INCOMING!!!!!!!!